Craig Proctor Lied to Me!
Recently, Jim received an email from Craig Proctor, aka Quantum Leap System, inviting him to dial into a conference call and learn how to stop wasting time on insincere buyers and learn how to turn homebuyers into a huge profit center. Jim asked me to dial in and find out about this amazing discovery.
In this email, Craig said that I would learn some pretty specific things, and the following list is a direct quote from his email dated 9-11-06:
“Remember, on this call you’ll learn:
• How to NEVER have a buyer waste your time again
• How to EASILY compel your buyers to demand your service and be willing to pay you a non-refundable $495 retainer in advance
• How to increase your average commission and make 3.5% or more per buyer transaction (with no worries about what the co-broke fee offered is ever again)
• The step-by-step system that prevents demanding, unreasonable, buyers from ever wasting a minute of your valuable time!
• How to get the most motivated and qualified buyers in the market to pick up the phone and call you, begging for you to sell them a home”
I was quite excited and prepared to take notes on the steps and systems I needed to do to learn how to be so incredibly effective with the right buyers. In fact, I had an entire spiral notebook ready for several pages of notes. The call was hosted by three real estate agents who claim to have had success with Craig’s systems.
I have to say, however, that by the end of the call, I had written less than half a page worth of mildly valuable information, and I was quite disappointed. The first half of the call was spent with the agents telling their personal story of how they used to be starving in real estate, couldn’t make ends meet, were working a million hours every week, owed the IRS thousands of dollars, etc. and then after they purchased Craig’s system, their careers turned around and now life is perfect, they have tons of money, and have other people doing all the work for them… Yada, Yada, Yawn!
I think we are all a little tired of the cliché rags to riches stories so popular in the mantra of network marketing scams and crazy religious cults. Ok, so maybe you had a great experience and Craig’s system really did work for you. I didn’t call in for your personal testimony of generalities – I called in to get the specific how-to’s relating specifically to homebuyers that I was promised. I got no specifics. In fact, the only “real” information, albeit limited, that I did get out of the entire call was that part of Craig’s system includes running ads in periodicals and using an automated 800# hotline. But, again, no specifics and no answers in the list of 5 things I was promised. A lot of real estate trainers promote ads and hotlines – no information was provided to tell me why I should use Craig’s system over any other.
I gathered that the entire purpose of the call was to get me to either buy Craig’s system or to pay him to attend the upcoming conference. The attitude of “pay me now and then I’ll tell you what you are buying” did NOT win me over. I know that Craig will probably get people to sign up and make money off this call – but, I am going to hold his feet to the fire on this one. He did not deliver the 5 things he promised. I know nothing more about his system than I did before I called. And therefore, I have no reason to give him my money.
I have gotten the same e-mails from Craig inviting me to attend the conference call. My thinking was that many agents are looking for the “magic pill” and that ultimately, Craig will try to sell his system and make some extra cash from the teleconference.
September 13th, 2006 at 8:44 amBack a few years ago my wife and I went to Craig’s 3 day seminar in Florida. There was a money back guarantee up until the middle of the second day. Up to that point there was some usefull information and I figured with another day and half we would find enough to make it worthwhile.
The whole thing took a 360. It went from usefull (but most of it was stuff I already knew) information to a MAJOR SALES PITCH. They had every vendor there tell why Craig used their product and try and sell you very expensive (overpriced) services. Any service Craig uses he also sells at an inflated price. I have never heard “it will only take one transaction to make this worthwhile” so many times in a 24 hour time frame.
I wish I had taken the day to go site seeing or something. It was a waste of time and money.
September 13th, 2006 at 9:17 amI went to the Craig Proctor Superconference (as he calls it) last November 2005 down in Palm Desert CA. I’ve got mixed feelings about the whole thing. He obviously has made a ton of $$ selling real estate outside of Toronto. Of course, he’s got his team of sellers and buyers agents that actually go out on the sales calls. Heck, he hasn’t been on a sales call in years - he doesn’t have to. And there are many of his ’students’ that have duplicated his systems around North America and make a ton of $$ too. Rick Brash, Brian Moses, Todd Walters and the list goes on and on. So they’ve definitely put it to use and stuck with the system.
If you want SEO (search engine optimization) then yes, do NOT use the Success websites as they’re just template websites. He still relies on running small, inexpensive classified ads. However I question how ‘inexpensive’ those ads are depending on your market and the cost of your Sunday real estate section!
Yes, Proctor has relationships with every vendor that is at his conferences. One thing that did really get old was that starting mid way on the second day they were pushing joining the ‘coaching program’ BIG TIME. That my friends costs $1K per month for 1 year. Not cheap. Now I did talk to some ‘regular folks’ in the audience that were in coaching and they all said that it was a help in their business so I don’t know. But there’s no doubt, they push, push and push some more to get you to join. It’s a helluva big commitment.
Now I did talk to one guy today that joined coaching - he was at the conference with me and he hasn’t done very well I don’t think since last November. He’s been running a bunch of different classified ads in his local papers, and has generated tons of leads. But therein lies the challenge - converting leads to clients! The type of ads that generally draws the best response are some type of a first time homebuyer ad, distress sale/foreclosure ads and so forth. The problem is that those types of ads draw a low class type client - people with poor credit and no $$. So you’ve got to go through alot of work to find the ‘diamond in the rough’ so to speak.
I think the system can work for most anybody, but you’d better have a deep pocketbook and be willing to put in a ton of hours for probably several years at least to get it up and running. But the one knock that I do have is that if you’re looking to pull business from the various search engines, you’re going to have to have a different website than anything that Success websites does.
September 18th, 2006 at 10:36 pmRick,
September 19th, 2006 at 6:48 amThanks for the great comment. Excellent!
I’m trying to find a good website for ‘unbranded’ purposes but I don’t want to go with Success websites as they’re hosting fees (especially if you want to add any audio or video) are very expensive. What I’m looking for is a website similar to Success websites, where you have these free reports that people request and that are sent back to them (as soon as they fill in their contact info) by an ‘auto responder’. I saw somewhere that somebody said to check out Brian Rodgers, which I’ve attempted to do, but have gotten no reply. Which does not give me the ‘warm and fuzzy’ feeling too much.
Maybe I’ll just go with the 800 hotlines that I have with AMS. If anybody has any tips or the name of another reputable web site company that has similar website content to Success website where they can make an unbranded website filled with the free reports, please let me know. Thanks.
September 19th, 2006 at 9:48 pmRick,
September 23rd, 2006 at 3:30 pmRe: an unbranded site that uses the free reports similar to the Success websites:
I am using Advanced Access which allows you to have your own look and create all the pages you would need for your reports and auto responders. You could set it up to have unbranded looking pages with various domain names pointing to those “unbranded” pages. The hosting fee is only $29 per month
I am glad I read the above comments. I have been listening to Craigs conference calls pereodiclly. I have also felt lead on by the calls. The are to general and do not provide any real information. I was planning on go to one of his conferences but now I don’t think that I will.
December 28th, 2006 at 7:57 pmThank you very much for your information. I was almost ready to purchase Craig Proctors program. I am curious though, how does he guarantee the sale of a home in 30 days?”
December 30th, 2006 at 10:44 amYou guys are crazy!!You want something for nothing!! Of course he wants you to buy his package, and join coaching. If youve been in this business long enough, you know that all we have is our TIME and KNOWLEDGE. Dont you think that his time and knowlrdge are worth something. This man makes over 3million a year in commissions. Please dont take me wrong, I am not attacking anyone, but this is common sense. What impressed me from the beginning are a few valid things. 1) The free calls he gives are live!! They are recorded and then as they get closer to his next conference, they are replayed. If you get on a few FREE calls after a conference, you can actually press #1 and talk to Craig himself. What more could you ask for. 2) When I met these guys, whom I have now become friends with, ex. Brain Moses, Joey Trombley, Danny Griffin, Etc. They are the nicest people. They have returned everyone of my phone calls to them and my e-mails with either an e-mail or a phone call. These are guys that are now selling over 400 and500 homes. If you really listen , there may be an ad here or there with a success story and a new car. They are very hard to find. All I have ever heard from these guys (and I mean from personally talking to them) , and in 95% of Craigs ads is that this system is about getting your life and your family back. Not how many millions you can make. If anyone can find one ad from Craig telling you how much money can be made where that is the focal point he is making please send it to me!! Go to a Floyd Wickman, or Tom Hopkins conference, and hear about putting 1000 pumpkins out at halloween with your card on it, and how to handle rejection. These guys havent sold real estate in years. Just understand this, Our Business is about leads. Craigs system will get you those leads, and as one other person stated, yes some ads bring in some poor leads. But I will tell you , when you can pick and choose because you have so many, it is an awesome thing. The other thing he teaches that will amaze you is how to run a business in real estate. I laugh every time I get a new pkg. in the mail from him . Every thing he gives you is complete and tested . No huge manuals that are just full of fluff. Always easy step by step on how to do what he is doing. I hope this helps people. But hey if you dont want it thats fine with me I dont want everyone getting in on my secrets.
Grateful and satisfied CP Coaching Member
January 5th, 2007 at 9:40 pmI don’t know how else to say it but run the ads and they will come.. I’m just glad that there are so many people bashing craig and what he does. That makes my job that much more secure by having less competition! You attended the call right. Why? Direct Response Advertising.. Enough said..
Another Grateful and Satisfied Proctor Member
January 8th, 2007 at 2:41 pmWell 3 days ago i tryed to order the system but kept getting voice mail. the operator kept sending me the ext 222 , are they that busy.. im debating if i should go for the 800.00
January 13th, 2007 at 6:56 pmO.K., I purchased The Quantum Leap System 1 1/2 years ago. I found it to be a lot of buy this and buy that. Most of it in my opinion was pitching how you need to buy Craig’s website for $60 month, buy hotline numbers from a company he reccomends for $40/month etc. etc. I placed the ads…..nothing. I bought the hotlines…..nothing. So I decide to sell it on e-bay!, 2 days into the listing Craig Proctor contacts e-bay claiming that me selling it on e-bay violates the “user agreement”, that I just purchased a licsense to USE this product, and thus couldn’t resell it. When I contacted Craig he claimed that there was a little blue piece of paper in the box that was the license agreeement! Of course there wasn’t, but how do you prove a negative. So I paid $800 bucks for a lot of information on more products that I could buy from Craig, and when I try to recoup some of my losses my auction is pulled for what was listed as a “software infringement”. ( there is no software in this system )
January 14th, 2007 at 2:49 pmNice huh ?
Thanks for the info i will not buy it what other system out there is good?
January 14th, 2007 at 3:50 pmHey Ken. Did you try any of the ideas in the package. you obviously kept it past the 30 day money back guarantee. The best piece in there is the fast start guide. Yes it says call the web company (you need to have a good website). You dont need the 800 #s at first although when you start the system and see how well it works, you will see why you will eventually need it. The best part about Craigs websites is that all of the material that you are going to offer in the ads is already there. it is truly turn key. why is everyone so upset that this guy makes money on outside things. Its not his web company. He went to a website company and worked with them to design what he needed to build the system. Do you think Ray Kroc made money every time he franchised a new mcdonalds location. You are seriously missing out on something special. Yes, eventually you will have to spend money. What business do you know of that you would not reinvest some of your profit back into your business. The fast start guide is a great overview of everything. Just do what it says. The websites are FREE for 60 days. Get 1 website, run 1 or 2 ads. You already spent the 800.
Steve: Trust me, you should judge for yourself. Make sur you are calling the right number, and tell the girl answering that you have been having problems. You are calling Craigs office, not some call center so understand that they will mak it right. Hope this helps!
Ultra-Satisfied CP Coaching Member
January 16th, 2007 at 9:24 amI think thoust protest too much .
Why are these guys SO concerned that I didn’t find this system worth while? For agents that are so busy answering leads from ads they placed, showing and selling houses they seem to be checking this thread daily. Why do they care? Is it possible they work for this company? Now I don’t know that, but seems odd to me that such busy agents are concerned about whether you buy this product or not. If it were working for me I wouldn’t want the competition to know about it, would you? The more people that buy it the greater the chance that more than 1 agent in your area will be running simlar ads in the same papers and offering the same programs. Hmmmmm.
The ONLY reason I shelled out $800 for this, or any other program is because I saw it on ebay with a lot of bids and selling for over $500. I figured it must be good with that kind of activity, and since I just moved to Remax I thought I’d buy myself a new one directly from the company. If it wasn’t for me I’d resell it on ebay and recoup some of my losses. That was before this company pulled my listing claiming that even though no mention was made of a license agreement at any time during my 1/2 hour call, that their is one and I agreed to it because they put a blue piece of paper in the box saying so and I didn’t return the program.
I did use the fast start guide, etc. I ran the ads, I signed up for the hotline, etc. I drew the line at the website. Check out some other articles, one entitled “Craig Proctor Lied to me ” . I don’t have the link but just search it on Yahoo or Google. The guy says the same thing I’m saying about a invitation he got via e-mail to listen in a phone call.
You do what you want, but consider that all these busy agents have the time to keep watching this thread, and the company itself is watching Ebay to make sure no one is selling this item. Aren’t they supposed to be so busy selling houses ?
January 16th, 2007 at 10:41 amOopps, This is the article,…nevermind !
January 16th, 2007 at 10:44 amWhat about his free half day seminars? Has anyone gone to those? Is that another sell job with no good information? Look forward to your responses. Thanks
January 22nd, 2007 at 3:02 pmI went to the half day free seminar, they give you a few good ideas, but the obvious pitch is to buy his 3 day seminar, Im think about buying the leap system, just to get the ads, i wld rather be talking to a lot of leads, than have none at all, none of the other real estate guru’s are cheap either, and most of them, have never even sold real estate, at least Proctor has and still does, to set yourself appart from others is my goal, I use a few ideas from different sources, an agent must spend some money to improve hi/her self, as all of you have, I have looked at a lot of programs, and I also am afriad of loosing money gained the hard way, I do not think the entire program, will apply to me, but any help, that works, is better than none, $800.00 is really very cheap, look at college prices, our mls fee;s, nar and the rest of of the fee;s we pay
January 29th, 2007 at 8:50 pmSave your money Melody. The ads didn’t work for me and I ran them exactly as it was laid out. ONE call total. The person never responded when I followed up. Unless your in an area where the buyers and sellers are intellectually challenged, most aren’t falling for “27 free tips to sell your home for the most money”, etc etc. They know someone’s on the other end waiting to sell them something. I obviously have a beef with this company since they filed a complaint against me for trying to sell this item on Ebay. ( to recoup my losses )But if it was worth even $100 I wouldn’t be selling it. One of the manuals is almost all pitches to get you to BUY into more programs,and it’s almost 2 inches thick. OH, and be careful, if you think you BUYING this you’re wrong. They didn’t tell me this on the phone when they took my $800, but supposidly there was a blue sheet of paper in the box that stated this was a license to use only. I don’t actually own it and thus can’t resell it. They’ve sent me this blue piece of paper and it reads like another sales pitch, not a legal license of any kind. For some all the money in the world just isn’t enough I guess. I wouldn’t recommend this system to anyone.
January 31st, 2007 at 2:54 pmWe have followed the Craig Proctor Program for 6 months and it is starting to really pay off. You have to stick with it and follow their instructions. We get several leads each day and have converted them to listings. We also have alot of buyers coming through the websites and ads.
You have to spend money on ads and the websites, as well as advertising the websites.
February 2nd, 2007 at 12:23 pmHmmmm…maybe KEN works for the competition…thats what I’m thinking…real estate is ALL about systems folks…we did it the hard way last year and banged out about 120 transactions…I’m just beginning with the Proctor stuff and I KNOW it will work because of my past experiences with very similar stuff…and I DONT work for him…but anytime you can make the phone ring that much…youre in the wrong business if you cant make some $$$!!!!
February 6th, 2007 at 3:31 pmHi everyone, I live 45 min from Proctors marketing area in Ontario Canada. I have competitors )Remax) agents who have been following his system. Anyting can work if you work. His ideas are no secret potion. I guess some agents get motivated with the info and just get to work. Lets face it, we can all make alot more if we work harder and smarter. I truly believe there is no easy way to be successful in Real Estate.
February 8th, 2007 at 8:12 pmCraig loves himself and sells his wares accordingly. Its all about the money. Hire 5 assistants, place your little lead generator calls etc etc.
Ive never been impressed by an agent who claims to sell 200 or 400 homes a year when you know damn well that its not him selling the homes but 3-10 other agents that he takes the credit for. Hes just a salesman acting as a broker within a brokerage.
It leads to impersonal relationships and alot of unhappy clients. If I hire Craig I want Craig not sue or bill or dave.All information that you can use to help earn more money is good, He does have some good ideas but theyre not worth what he is charging. Write a book craig,list your ideas and sell it for $29.95
Your No Donald Trump.
Jeffery,
You’ve hit it right on the head, you’ve seen through my disguise. I work for the competition and am writing that I think this Quantum Leap system isn’t worth 1/4 of what they are charging because I work for the competition. Even though I didn’t mention any other system to purchase that was better, that was all a part of my master plan. I don’t care if they buy “my product”, I just don’t want them to buy this product .
It’s all very Silly Jeff, I’d hate to negotiate a transaction against someone of your superior intellect to be able to see through me like you have. Bravo. I also like your use of Capital letters and exclamation points. You really drove your point home with those. ( I would have used about 5 more exclamation points, it really shows you’ve patted yourself on the back that way. )
Oh, just curious, If you “know” that this will work because “you’ve done similar programs” in the past, why did you order this one? Did you have 800 bucks just lying around that you wanted to spend on something you already knew about and have done before? Say hi to Craig for me.
Ken
February 9th, 2007 at 6:57 amSorry Jeff, I meant Timmy, not you in my response.
ken
February 9th, 2007 at 7:02 amRobin,
February 9th, 2007 at 7:35 amI think you’re right on the money. I’m not saying that this system could never work for anyone, as obviously some are doing well with it. It just didn’t work for me in my area. If Craig didn’t go out of his way to file a complaint against me in Ebay I wouldn’t bother with this thread….let the buyer beware. However to charge this kind of money, then turn around and claim that you purchased a license to use only, and that selling it on Ebay is a violation of that is in my opinion wrong. I purchased this system. No one mentioned when I ordered this on the phone that I was licensed to use it only, and that I can’t sell it if I so choose. I’m not selling a copy, I didn’t make a copy, I’m trying to sell the original that I purchased directly from this company. Many have sold before I tried to sell it, and many have sold since. There is even someone selling the system on Ebay as an E-book for exactly the price you stated, $29.95. Now THAT I can see being possibly a copyright infringement. However they haven’t pulled any of these listings, or any other that have come on for sale since they singled me out and pulled mine. So if anyone wants to know my motivation for posting on this site that is it. I think I’m getting singled out and that I was sold a License to use this system only and wasn’t told that when I paid for it. I feel that is deceptive.
Wow - what a fun and interesting discussion.
I know there are agents who have made money with Craig’s system and those who have not. I think it all depends on your personal marketing preferences and your local market.
Ken, I am so sorry to hear about your experience - I would be pretty ticked as well.
I have not used Craig’s system, but as my article explains, my biggest beef was that he clearly promised specific things in the free call. And he did not deliver.
I never expected him to divulge all the secrets of his program - but I did expect him to honor his written word.
February 9th, 2007 at 3:39 pmthe best thing to do is go out there and knock on doors no systems needed!!!
February 10th, 2007 at 4:14 pmMy website is from Z57 (www.z57.com) and I have been very happy with them for the past year. I previously had a success website from Craig Proctor, and also found it very expensive and not terribly effective. My Z57 site runs about half of what the Success site did (about $80 per month) and they have various autoresponders depending on which form the user fills out and a very helpful and responsive marketing department. Another thing I like is that you can change the homepage and theme from dozens of preformatted themes with the click of a mouse. Only the webmaster could make limited changes to the theme or home page of the Success site. The site seems a lot more straightforward and uncluttered, and allows me to easily write specific reports for inclusion in the real estate tips section and to personalize every page with a simple editor (but a lot of the content is just fine as it is…)
For the 800 call capture system, I use the Proquest system and have been extremely happy with them. Not only do they provide the 800 service, they are very liberal with providing marketing tips and creative ways to make it work for you. I have found them to have a very win-win attitude toward their customers.
I have used a lot of lead generation systems and have boiled it down to these two programs, and use Google Adwords to generate the traffic (vs. paying $50-$60 per lead from services who do the same thing). Also, don’t forget to cross promote your website in every piece of advertising and mailing you do.
- Pat
February 13th, 2007 at 10:27 amWow! I stumbled on this website and was shocked by some of the comments. I have freinds that tried to “half way” do the Craig Proctor system. The results that they got were next to nothing if anything at all. I have tried several coaching programs and have found that they all promise alot. I found that once I got back and tried to put into practice all that I had learned, I spent more time trying to prefect a system than selling real estate. The Craig Proctor system says “Here is what I did, and you can too” Is it expensive? YES! (are they tax deductible? you’ll have to ask your accountant.) Does it work? Yes! Is it perfect? No! Are they working on it, to prefect it? Yes!
I have just finished the coaching program and and now in the graduate program. The coach worked with me to do some small things to prefect my ads that I already ran. They worked well. I went from very little response to between 20 and 50 leads a week. We also learned to NOT spend money on things that didn’t work and to wait to spend money until I could convert the leads the were comming in. I was not impressed with Success Websites and have opted to use another. They provide both the branded and non-branded sites for half the price and were much easier to work with to make changes. I have used AMS 800 numbers since 2003 and have not found any other service to come close to what they can do.
All in all, I view the Craig Proctor System as the Harvard of Real Estate Training. Just because you have visited the campus, doesn’t mean that you have an education. You must take what they are teaching and apply it. I looked at it as buying into a franchise that no one else or very few are using in my area. There are alot of people that will not pay for it because of the price. That is fine by me. While many of my friends have gotten out of the business in 2006, I have picked up market share while working less than 30 hours per week on average. (Had some heart problems that I needed to fix, all better now!) I can truly say that since 2003, I have NOT made a cold call, I have not knocked on doors, and I have not worked more than 40 hours in a week on average. I work to live not live to work. I make a comfortable living and I enjoy life.
Ken, I’m sorry to hear that The Craig Proctor System did not work for you….yet. I have perfected an ad that ran last year. I run it every week and get 7 to 10 leads a week without fail. Although I have had all the campaigns for over a year, I am just now getting ready to apply another ad campaign. The beauty of this system is that you can apply what you bought years ago, today and it will work. If you would like to email me, I will be happy to help tweek your ads for you, or help with some other area of the system.
This is not the only real estate program out there, but it works best for me.
Sincerely,
February 20th, 2007 at 9:02 amSteve Saunders
Hey thanks everyone for the great info. I’m just getting back into real estate sales. I left in 1996 to pursue other avenues. I think I will order Craig’s program with the intent to mail it back prior to 30 days! Unless I find it worth while to keep.
Gary Keller’s book “The Millionaire Real Estate Agent” is EXCELLENT. Bottom line more leads, produce more lisitings and the implemetation of “LEVERAGE” produces anew life. style. Craig has certainly leveraged himself. Leverage is the key to enjoying real estate. Gary talks about the four stages of success. 1) THINK, 2) EARN, 3) NET, & 4th) RECEIVE.
Thanks everyone
February 20th, 2007 at 2:17 pmPaul
If anyone would like to sell thier quantum leap system to me in a PRIVATE PARTY TRANSACTION, please email me at emcpower@yahoo.com
February 20th, 2007 at 2:32 pmHey Eric,
February 20th, 2007 at 5:33 pmDid you try contacting Ken above (see post above about the ebay experience)? Hopefully, the Proctor police won’t harass him again.
Another Grateful and Satisfied Proctor Member Said:
… You attended the call right. Why? Direct Response Advertising.. Enough said..
——————————————-
I find this comment interesting (aside from the fact this person chose to remain anonymous). Yes, I responded to the email Craig sent.
But that is not “enough said” because he did not deliver what he promised. If I did the same thing to homebuyers and sellers, my reputation as a Realtor would be affected. That doesn’t exactly help me make money or get my life back, does it?
February 20th, 2007 at 5:51 pmMy partner and I attended the half day seminar and bought what we thought was the complete system. There were a half dozen reports similar to the ones that you can download from your board for free. I just listened to a teleconference call - definitely pre recorded and hung up after a half hour of a pitch on why I should buy that hideous website that actually asks for people’s SIN numbers, employers, etc in a non secure environment - (duh!! let’s make it easy to have our future clients identity stolen). I hung up as am sure the next half hour was a pitch to buy the postcards, etc.
The whole approach is so used car - “now that you’ve bought the car, would you like to buy the brakes too?” I could not and would not ever deal with my clients in that way.
NEVERTHELESS, I do feel that there is a lot of sense in the system. Attending the free works shop and sleuthing around would have given me as much information as purchasing the system and lots less frustration as we sift through these poorly organized manuals for something useful. My advice is to attend the free seminar, do some research, sounds like it could be worth attending the conference so long as you take advantage of the money back guarantee and you want to visit wherever it is being held.
I am quite sure the system will work, but it’s not rocket science, is very simple and are just trying to make more money by selling you more and delivering little. I do know someone who can do a website that does much the same thing but has a lot more class.
February 21st, 2007 at 3:25 pmIf anyone wants this system I’ve got it back on Ebay now. I filed what’s called a counter notice on Craig Proctor to either file a federal law suit against me or if he didn’t within 14 days of being notified I could relist it. He had no case, so he didn’t file the suit. ( my lawyer wishes he had ) Anyway, it’s back on Ebay if anyone wants to buy it. The buy it now price is $450, a real steal at that price ! ;0 )
February 21st, 2007 at 4:18 pmJust Be Sure You Know What You Want!
February 22nd, 2007 at 11:10 amI signed up for the CP Seminar in Colorado last winter. I journeyed there with my wife seeking to pick up some good techniques and information on improving my business. The seminar was a mix of how-to-run your real estate business, and testimonials from some real hard-luck cases who’d turned things around using the Proctor program. I left after buying mostly the whole package including coaching.
My results after several months of using the ads, web sites and 800 numbers were dismal. Coaching was expensive and I found little dollar benefit from the ads or coaching. Another agent in my area was using the Proctor program also, so I had no exclusive on that aspect of marketing. On the positive side, they will teach you how to organize yourself into an effective RE agent or company using some tested materials and plans. I’d recommend calling people who are both delighted and disappointed with the results of CP Seminars and related products before jumping in. It takes some serious cash to play and your results might not be very stellar. I’d rate the experience a mixed bag that could be duplicated elsewhere. I did not feel that I was being lied to or cheated, however, and many things I purchased have been useful to me.
Ken, enjoy taking back pop bottled to fill your rusty car with enough gas to get to your other job at the fast food restaurant you work at! Why is it you are so jelous of successful people? Losers always tend to be like this aren’t they? Anyway, Craig has done wonders for my business as well as many others I’ve met with and become friends with. I know you wish this wasn’t the case but for you nothing you try in life will be a success. You know I’m right don’t you Ken?
Have a pleasant day.
February 23rd, 2007 at 3:00 pmBuck, bucks, bucks give me more bucks. Thats what you get. I found a new system and now biz is taking off.
PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
February 24th, 2007 at 5:55 amThe complaints I have read paint a picture of some very naive people. I might also say it is what we call a “VICTIM” mentality. Craig’s system does work and I use it myself. To ignore Craig’s success and Craig’s results is probably very foolish…but ALAS there is no magic pill…this “FRANCHISE” like system is for entrepreneurs who want to put in place a proven system. However, like any system or franchise it will take money, hard work and some serious training. TO me Craig’s program, his staff and his team has been spectacular, straight-forward, honest, ethical, polished, and a “CLASS ACT. Craig is a true master of the game. Stop your “VICTIM” mentality and go sell some houses!
Bob Guest (512)671-8828
February 24th, 2007 at 7:37 amI’ve attended Craig Proctor’s conferences since November of 2003. I’ve been in real estate since 1962 and for the first time in my life I’ve met one that has “it” together. Every aspect of real estate selling and marketing. Those who have not been committed to his program are in my opinion not willing to “pay the price” of personal time and commitment to grow a business. I will always be greatful to Craig, Todd, Brian, and others for their tireless assistance and never once have I been disappointed. His program is fantastic. I’m sorry that those who might believe otherwise and who are so willing to discredit Craig. I am a believer! (I hope these positive comments will get posted and read) Jerry Groenig - Yakima, Washington
February 24th, 2007 at 8:53 amI have never blogged before, but I feel I need to now. Having spent 2 years on a Navy Reserve mobilization that caused my Real estate production to drop to nearly zero, I needed help to get back in the game. Because of Craig Proctor’s systems. in just 2 short years I went from zero to outperforming over 91% of the agents in my market. And before CP Systems 100% of my transactions were people in my sphere of influence, now 90% of my transactions are clients I did not previously know due to these superb marketing systems taught by Craig Proctor. And I tried other coaching systems such as one that directed you to cold call and go push people to “sign the contract” or to give them gifts until they refer everyone they know resulting in them ultimately avoiding you. Those other systems did not work for me.
February 24th, 2007 at 8:55 amNow leads are contacting me! I’m having to add staff to respond to all of them and conduct business as well. His ideas just keep getting better. I can’t keep up with implementing all the great ideas. I have a business not a hobby or a job. I spoken with many of his members (some much younger than I) that have been so successful and so systemized they’ve delegated almost everything except the lead generation machine and are making millions! I will get there soon thanks to Craig! His system wasn’t easy and it wasn’t free. I met two guys that just took one idea from Quantum Leap and went from poverty to hanging on the beach in Hawaii when Donald Trump’s staff calls him about all the pre-solds he’s done for his high rises.
So, from someone who’s willing to fight for the wonderful freedom we enjoy, if you don’t like it, and you are not interested, this is a free country and don’t play. Just sent it back. He does honor his 30 day money back guarantee. And I did receive a paper that said you could not re-sell his system.
Sincerely,
Colorado Barb
I have been following Craig’s system for the last 3 years and I can honestly say that they have caused a dramatic change in my business (I average 150 transactions/year and dont work weekends)-and no,I don’t work for Craig.The only reason I am responding is to give a more balanced view of some of these negative and bizarre comments that I have read on this thread.For sure anything of value takes some work to impliment but there lies the key-if you don’t impliment or don’t do it properly it won’t work.Just as opening a McDonalds and not serving the food the way that they tell you-you won’t have success.I have met people from all over North America who have worked Craig’s system and are doing terrificly well at it. I have never found my dealings with Craig’s company to be anything but efficient,straightforward,and that I always got More than was promised.Craig has been one of the top selling Realtors in the world for the last 15 years and that stat is independantly verifiable….why would I even think of studying someone else who hasn’t sold real estate in 20 years or in some cases never?As far as the ads not working and the leads not being worthwhile I have sold at least one house a week just from my CP internet ads and have tons of people to follow up with today.I think if you polled 100 people who have studied what Craig teaches 95 would tell you they are very happy and that it has transformed their business.Some people just don’t get it.If anybody would like more info or help just email me anytime …davidthompson@remax.net
February 24th, 2007 at 9:20 amAdding to Bob Guest’s comments I too am in Craig’s coaching program and have found it to be quite effective. Having owned franchises (outside real estate) before, I was conditioned to forcast a fixed cost towards training in our budget planning. Paying what we have for Craig’s coaching for the last 3 years has been worth every penny. Is it for everyone? Obviously not. Is it pretty and perfect? No, but what is? I will tell you that if you make this investment and stick with it you will be rewarded with a solid business model that works. Additionally, you will be part of a community of agents that sincerely give of themselves to make you better at what you do. Try it, what do you have to lose? 12 grand? Really? If I were to offer to make you an extra $50k in profit this year but you had to give me $12k to make it happen, you wouldn’t do it? That’s what it did for us our first year. Good Luck.
February 24th, 2007 at 9:56 amDave,
February 24th, 2007 at 10:10 amHow did you find out about this thread? You stated you already have Craig’s system and have been using it for years. I’m just curious why you were searching the internet under Craig Proctor and stumbled upon this site and then felt compelled to reply. Also, do you know of 100 people who used Craig’s system? How do you have any idea that 95% would tell me that they were happy with it? It’s also curious that you feel so strongly about this that you would give out your personal e-mail to answer questions about someone else’s marketing program ? Just find it interesting.
Anyone else reading this thread, DOES ANYONE FIND IT ODD THAT ALL OF THESE PEOPLE, WHO ALL WROTE IN ON THE 24TH, WERE ALL SEARCHING THE INTERENET FOR CRAIG PROCTOR EVEN THOUGH THEY ALREADY PURCHASED HIS SYSTEM ? What a coincidence ! 4 agents, ALL found this thread on the same day ! They all had glowing results, and they’re willing to share their experiences and answer questions for anyone ! Wow, what a country….and what a crock !
February 24th, 2007 at 10:16 amDo not comment on something you do not understand!
A good friend of mine two and a half years ago asked me to accompany him to Craig’s Superconference in Phoenix and he gave me the same advice…. “Do not comment on something you do not understand!”
I trusted my buddy and went to the 3 day lecture and left with information overload and lots of notes.
Having been in Mike Ferry’s coaching for 3 years and Leaders Choice for 2 years as well as owning every book on real estate sales and a multitude of vhs taped (remember those), audio cassette tapes and dvd’s by these “guru’s” who offer recycled how-to’s to your way to a million dollars, Craig actually still sells…. yes, contrary to the blog comments, Craig still makes calls himself from his home office, and is not selling has-been techniques or repackaging other agents success techniques!
I went from selling between 50 and 60 homes a year on my own to last year 80 deals and this year will exceed 100 transactions, with only 1 team agent while working only 20 hours a week in the field the balance in implementing many of Craig’s system’s that generate not only lots of leads, but many of them great leads. In fact, from the last 2 years of using Craig’s system, I have another listing from the “old leads I have been keeping in contact with” and at least 6 more coming that I know about already from the existing ones.
My suggestion to anyone reading this bloggers comments is… How successful is this agent! Look at the positive comments in reply and investigate Craig’s system as it not only works…. but it is landmark for our profession where prospects chase us for help rather than us calling, door knocking and open housing begging for them to sit down with us!!!
Rather than taking what you think is the best of Craig’s stuff and looking for other venues to implement it cheaper, I suggest that you stop blogging and just keep learning how to improve your business, your bottom line profitability and your quality of family life… all, tools you will learn from Craig Proctor!
February 24th, 2007 at 10:32 amKen I’m sorry that you feel so strongly negative about a program that has clearly helped many people.I know hundreds of people who have successfully used Craig’s system and have personally met many of them and interact with them on a regular basis.I would say that I do a pretty good job in my real estate business and still only please about 95% of the people that I deal with…no matter what you do you can’t please everybody.Another point to consider is that many of the top people of virtually all the major real estate companies in North America use Craig’s system as their main source of business and business model.That is just plain fact…so good luck to you in the future..I hope things turn around for your real estate business.
February 24th, 2007 at 12:05 pmMy Real estate business is just fine PAL. I’m not the one who started this post. I question how so many of you Proctor deciples found this on your own. Just doesn’t make any sense. What does make sense is that you were contacted and asked to post. How else would you find this site to begin with. Were you just searching for Craig Proctor because he’s your hero? Please, don’t insult everyone’s intelligence here. This is simply damage control.
February 24th, 2007 at 1:00 pmIf you want to learn how to fix cars, learn from a proficient auto technician. I sold 30 houses the year before I started learning from Craig. I joined his coaching program. The first year while learning I closed 50 deals. 3 years later while continuing to learn I did $1,200,000+ in commissions. If you want to gripe and complain and make what you made last year, just do what you did last year. If you want to learn from someone who knows how and is willing to teach you, Craig can help.
February 24th, 2007 at 8:17 pmKen,
I am a very satisfied CP Coaching Member!!! I was searching under Craig Proctor to see what other kinds of campaigns he is running. I feel sorry for you that you spend so much time here. This seems like Ken against Craig and his followers. All of your comments are so bitter. If you dont like it , move on! It amazes me that you are so angry that you were not allowed to sell this on ebay. Put yourself in his shoes. If you developed a true turn key system wouldnt you patent it and protect it. Sure you would. You had 30 days to reyurn it, and you know what, your not out that much. You could still learn alot of ideas from him and do your own thing, you know thast old “When Life Hands you Lemons ” thing! You have no idea what you are passing up, but hey I want everyone here to listen tyo you , because I love less competition. You all want something for nothing. Has anyone ever gone to a Calton Sheets seminar, or any other real Estate seminar. The Real people dont even show up. You get stand in Trainers. Craigs Real estae business now runs like clockwork without him, and to the woman who wrote earlier to discredit him for saying he sells 400+ homes per year and its his team and not him totally misses every point that could ever be made. How many people here go on vacation and their business suffers, or they get someone to cover them. This man has taught me to go on vacation and come home to new listings and Sales . Yes! his agents are doing all of the work as are mine, but it is his system that does it . These agents are handed leads, and being told what to say , andwhen to say it! Like a fine oiled machine. One thing will never change in this business. 20% of the agents in it sell 80% of the homes!!This is hard, and it costs money. But I am spending money in the right places and my personal coaches with CP helped me fix my mistakes. There are alot of people in this discussion that are not cut out to be super successful in this business. I only clicked on and check back to this blog to see what people are saying. To those of you not sure, just remember , negative people will hold you back your entire life. hey Ray Kroc could sell you a McDonalds, but if you didnt have the exact systems and you didnt buy his Fryers and other components , it wouldnt work . If Craig Proctor ever reads this , I want to say thank you as you are a great man. There , I said my peice. Hey Ken, Misery loves company, and you are doing you best to attract it! good luck .
February 24th, 2007 at 9:45 pmHey Ken one other thing, 17 listings and 9 sales from Jan1 til Today. Just me and Craigs system, 1 Assistant, and 1 Agent who is right now on a per deal basis. I am on track to sell 75 to 135 homes this year. As I am typing this 3 leads came in. Maybe I will buy that system off of you, just to help you sleep better at night. I m sorry I dont want to argue with you, but I do support Craig. Lets be real , that all things in life do not work for all people. Just find what works for you and move on. Liike I said before, most people in this business should not be in this business. The agents who understand that this is a business opportunity and not just a job or career are the ones who will thrive. I wish you well. I do not work for Craig either. I knoew coming into this business that to beat everyone else I would have to spend money , and lets face it, any successful business out there has a system . Craigs staff and other members are some of the nicest and hardest working people I have ever met. I hope you find what you are looking for, but then again maybe this blog is what makes you happy.
Thanks again Craig. See you in April!!!
February 24th, 2007 at 9:58 pmHey, any other happy members, I would love to talk to you sometime, look me up on the Coaching website and shhot me an e-mail.!!
February 24th, 2007 at 10:01 pmI was contacted and invited to give my imput for this blog, and of course was not instructed what to say either way. I have been a real estate broker for 29 years, I’ve trained with Alan Jacobson’s system, Tom Hopkin’s, ERA’s Fast Track, Century 21’s 2 & 1 and Operation Orbit, I am a “Sweathog”, a graduate of “The Listing Machine” system with Hilton Johnson,a commercial and residential appraiser and presently I’m in the One on One Mentor system with Mike Ferry, and this year I’m receiving the CCIM designation. I also run 3 radio shows in South Florida about real estate (Google the featured article “Realtors on the Radio” in Florida Realtor magazine), so I can say I know more ways to skin the cat than most agents out here.
February 24th, 2007 at 11:09 pmIn November 2005 I went to a Super Conference in Palm Desert, joined coaching and bought ALL the systems recommmended by Craig Proctor.
At the Super Conference they told us we would have more leads than we could handle, (I snickered at that time). When I came back I implemented the campaigns and got them going Jan 2nd. By late February I was drowning with leads (I had failed to implement the contact management system. When I finished coaching I was asked to join Platinum Level (by invitation only and much more than $1000 a month), and have been participating since January 2007.
Everything Craig Proctor has said and represented has been 100% true. When the system was not producing the results they promised was because I did not follow the directions as instructed (like when I used the contact management system “my way”). When ads were not giving me the expected results, all I had to do was get on the weekly ad call and they would help me tweak the ad or change the venue and it would become effective once more. If you use this system as instructed it WILL produce positive results, and I reconfirm this montly through my American Express payment to the Craig Proctor organization.
Am I worried that more people are going to join and create more competition for me? I have coached and mentored enough people to know that most are not willing to pay the price to succeed, if not why would 36.2% of realtors sell only 1 house a YEAR???!!!(Hope you complement me on my puntuation too, Ken).
One last point Ken, I find that most successful realtors are at a listing appointment Saturdays at 10:00 AM and not wasting their time writing in blogs. If you had tried that maybe the system would have worked you.
Let me assure everyone I do not work for Craig Proctor and couldn’t care less if anybody joins or nor, but give Caesar what is Caesar’s.
The system works if you work it. The help is not there and the weekly 1 hour callin conference seems prerecorded and they always plug the super conference and sell you something else. It is called a back end biz in real estate. Try Todd Bates and buy the way using his direct aprrouch stuff is making my bisness engine run like a charm. ProQuest Tech has got em all beat when it comes to direct response and I used the others. I get far more better leads!
And many realtors here online are just that realtors - worried about self image and the like whichyou never had. Our job is to market our services and not sell homes. Homeselling is a by-product of our marketing efforts which we must keep in check or we will go broke.
February 25th, 2007 at 6:13 amHey Marc,
You’re a shill, just admit it. You say you hope people listen to me because you don’t like competition? Then why are you spending all this time trying to convince anyone who reads this how great the system is. You’re not be geniune. I had a beef with this company, that’s why I wrote here. I’m not offering anyone free info if they contact me on my private e-mai etc. like some of you. So go ahead and question my motivation for writing here. That’s fine, I really could care less. I bought the system, it didn’t work for me. Period. 30 days isn’t enough time to evaluate all this info. Just to start some of the calls takes weeks. Be that as it may, you don’t understand the laws of the Unitied States of America. I or anyone else can sell a patented or copyrighted item if it is my own copy and not a reproduction. If that wasn’t the case no one could sell anything on Ebay or anywhere else. You wouldn’t be able to sell you car, or your bicycle, or you record collection,etc. Being copyrighted means you can’t make copies and sell them. Not that you can’t sell your own personal copy. It’s called the First Sale Doctrine. The seller loses all rights to a products resale once he is compensated for it once. I think they understand that now.
February 25th, 2007 at 6:15 amIf you are having sucess with it that’s great, I’m more than happy for you and everyone else who posted here. I never said this couldn’t work, I said the opposite in one post above actually. I found the program to be a lot of buy this and buy that, running into thousands and thousands of more dollars. I didn’t count on that, I don’t think many who purchased this system did. Maybe they did, I don’t know. Just keep your personal digs to you yourself. It really shows where you are coming from, and I think will have the opposite effect of what you are intending to do here. There, now I’ve spelled out my agenda. I done posting here, I’ve got houses to sell.
I can’t agree with your thinking. I’ve followed Craig Proctor & his system for the last 3.5 years & have found the information & ideas outstanding. Craig is the only mentor I know who actually practices Real Estate & not just talks about it. I’m sorry you’re disappointed but you really need to do your research before you publicly slam someone. Why couldn’t you just say the system’s not for you & move on? I’m just one of thousands who Craig has helped who will disagree with you. If anyone wants to ask me specific questions about what I’ve discovered working with Craig please don’t hesitate to email frkprindle@aol.com.
February 25th, 2007 at 8:14 amRaphael,
February 25th, 2007 at 9:53 amO.k., we’ve established one thing from your post. That many of these recent posts were done by cutomers of Craig Proctor and they were asked to blog on his behalf. Which is fine. Unfortunately I don’t have a list of all the dissatisfied purchasers of this system to contact, or I’m sure there would be many more with an opposing view to yours. If you read all the posts you would see that I am not alone in my dissapointment with the system. I don’t have to do research to give MY OPINION. I stated that I was dissapointed that what I thought was a turn-key product for $800 wasn’t, that the initial investment was just that, and I’d need to purchase many other systems down the road, and that most of this system can’t be implemented without buying these other systems. I’ll have to say that I found the 800 # to be useful, but not in conjunction with the Stealth ads. I find it a good listing tool to let the homeowner know that people can call from their car from the for sale sign and get detailed info. without having to track down an agent. I’m still utilizing an 800# system. The stealth ads didn’t work for me. I tried them, I spent a good deal of money on them, and only got one call. So I stopped doing it. I think every system including this one says to stop spending money on things that you don’t get a return on. Please keep in mind that I am not saying that this system can’t work for some, I’m sure it does. It didn’t work for me. I didn’t try to return it, I didn’t call them to complain about it, I just tried to resell it. That’s where my beef came in. It wasn’t for me, that’s all I’m saying. I wouldn’t recommend it. Maybe a different personallity type or whatever would dive into this and completely turn their business around. I don’t know. Just like you don’t know that this may not work for everyone, and not everyone has thousands of dollars to invest and find out. Good luck to you and everyone using this sucessfully. I mean that.
For the record:
February 25th, 2007 at 1:44 pmCraig Proctor has delivered on every promise he has made! I have been a Proctor coaching member for 2 years and my business has gone through the roof as a result of his “Quantum Leap System”. I highly recommend it.I went from 250K GCI to 895K GCI in 16 months. Made top 1% (74th)(Chairmans Club) in Canada from over 13,000 agents with Royal Lepage. Criag’s systems deliver!
Ralph Wiber
Red Deer, ALberta
Ken,
Hey no harm done. I think you are a good person, and hey if it didny work for you thats fine. I only offer communication to others because I have met so many people with CP that have helped me. The only reason I jumped to Craigs defense is because you took this in a direction towards people like they are working for Craig, or that it is all BS. I feel the same way you do , I wish you well in whatever you do, and yes people that have had success with CP are very quick to defend him. Alot of other trainers out there offer alot of things, but no clear cut way to implement them. Noit only does CP give you every step, but the exact steps within a phone call to your coach. Yes it costs $$ and the websites cost $$, and everything else, but sometimes you have to take a chance on yourself as well. These blogs are crazy, because you cant really sense someones demeanor when you are reading what they wrote. If I mistook your blogs as harsh and they were not, then I stand corrected. I think most people here that support the system just know what its like for someone to always tell them something wont work. They need to decide for themselves. Yes its true, I dont want other people in my area buying the system, but like I said I would gladly return the favor that Craigs staff extended to me and talk to someone else. I wish you well ken , and What ever works for you, I hope it works well. Good luck.
CP Coaching, Now Grad member!!
February 25th, 2007 at 3:19 pmTo Whom It May Concern:
I can not say if Craig Proctor’s systems are for everyone or not. But Craig asked me to comment on this post and share my experience, and out of respect for the man I am happy to oblige. Some people buy a paint brush expecting that they can hammer a nail in with it. What Craig offers are tools and systems. Craig can not be blamed though if the “Tool” that someone bought did not fit the job they were trying to accomplish with it. You have to follow the manufacturers instructions on proper use, and that is what Craig Proctor coaching is all about in my belief. He provides the tools and he provides instructions on their proper use.
Having said that, what I can share is my experience. Craig’s systems may not be for everybody, but they worked incredibly for me. My market place is Las Vegas, and I have gone from an agent that did 5 transactions in a year, to over 100. I am now 1 of the top 20 listing agents out of over 16,000 agents in Las Vegas. My GCI has jumped into the 7 figure range. I attribute all of my success to my painstakingly following every detail and applying ALL of the instructions that I received from Craig’s systems and coaching. So for me, my belief is that Craig’s systems work, if you are smart enough and willing to work hard enough to apply them.
Success leaves clues.
February 25th, 2007 at 4:39 pmI began using Craig’s systems in November of 2001. Never before meeting Craig had I achieved a GCI of $1,000,000 or more. I have now achieved this GCI in each of the last 4 years with my best being $2.7M. His tools may not work for all, but they sure as heck have worked for me. Now my story is not one of “rags to riches” as I had been fairly successful in all my career. But my numbers really exploded when I began using Craig’s systems, but better yet, I only work about 35 hours a week in my real estate business. I will spend most of my summer this year at my mountain home running my business by remote control. Thanks Craig.
February 25th, 2007 at 10:16 pmPut it this way, Craig’s system is that a SYSTEM. If you follow it step by step then you will succeed! Think about opening a McDonald’s franchise, they know the proper steps to get you up and running and how to be successful, in fact when was the last time you saw one go out of business! Well it is the same thing with Craig. You can pick the parts you like, however they won’t work, you need a combined and most importantly consistent system working for you, this will help your business grow.
I know many people who tried pieces of the system and they have all failed. I look at this as a 10 year process and I am on year 3 with Craig so do not expect a magic bullet overnight but do expect a consistent business that builds year after year!!
February 26th, 2007 at 12:42 pmI find Ken very childish. Because he was too lazy to work on the sound principles to improve his sales, he blames the coach, just like a little kid on a hockey team that is too lazy to learn to skate, “it’s the coach”. You think you are so smart to resell the product on eBay, hoping Craig would respond….like a taunting little child pulling another’s pigtails.
February 26th, 2007 at 8:39 pmAnd you are selling real estate???
I am thinking about purchasing the system and am now more confused as ever. I should never have even attempted to read any of this. I really thought that I could get a good handle on the advertising I needed to use and 800$ didn’t sound like a huge amount of money considering what I spend on ads. But I don’t want to be pressured during every conference call to buy something else. I guess I just thought he was trying to make extra money off his ideas, but it sounds like this is where he makes his money now…not is real estate. I mean….really, how much money does one person actually need? Does he or does he not sell real estate anymore?
February 27th, 2007 at 11:49 amKimi,
He does both.
“I mean….really, how much money does one person actually need?”
Are you serious?
February 27th, 2007 at 12:41 pmHelen,
February 27th, 2007 at 1:47 pmI think anyone reading your post will be completely confused as to what you are talking about. ” Just like a kid on a hockey team”, ” just like a child pulling pigtails”….what are you talking about ??? Yes, I’m selling real estate. I’d love to go up against you on a listing appointment. You make no point in you post, your arguement has absolutely nothing to do with my posts, and you pull them all together with these 3rd grade level analogy’s. You obviously didn’t understand that I did try this system and found it not to my liking. So how you can make the leap from that to anyone who didn’t like this system or that it didn’t work for them are “lazy” I find pretty obnoxious. Kind of like the story of the king with no clothes. Why can’t it just not be for everyone? Why do you have to sit in judgement and call people lazy if the system didn’t work for them. Let’s keep in mind that I also implemented this system 1 1/2 years ago, in a very strong seller’s market. It is possible that this system or any other wasn’t going to do near as well as in a nomral market because sellers just weren’t calling anyone or asking anyone for help. It was just too damn easy to sell on their own. On a final note, I’d rather be lazy than ignorant.
Oh Hellen,
One more thing…” you think you are so smart selling this on Ebay, hoping Craig would respond” . What on earth are you talking about???? I bought this system, didn’t like it, went to sell it on Ebay. MILLIONS of people sell things they don’t want or need on Ebay all the time. Are you saying I was hoping that Craig would contact Ebay and have my listing removed because they claim I purchased a license to use only ? I was never told this item was licensed at any time during the sale, or after the sale. There was no information with the product stating it was licensed to use only, and that I coudn’t sell it later if I wanted to. Once my listing was pulled, with a legally binding contract in the form of a high bidder, I filed a counter notice because I knew I did nothing wrong and I didn’t purchase or agree to any license to use only. ” I was hoping for Craig would respond “. Are you serious? One last time. There is something in the good ol’ USA called the First Sale Doctrine, that allows anyone to resell something after it was purchased legally and not duplicated. When you go to sell you Lawn Gnome collection you’ll be excersing your First Sale Doctrine right to do so….unless the manufacturer of that little cement elf claims they stuck a piece of paper in the box it came in stating that you were licensed to put this on your lawn only and that you can’t sell it if you wanted. Wouldn’t that be ironic?
February 27th, 2007 at 2:04 pmHelen….I am serious about how much does one person need to make? Maybe you are totally money oriented but I am not. I do not compete with my sales agents because I want them to make money. I have a great life and am satisfied with most aspects of it. I am interested in the system for my agents benefit….but I am not going to charge them for making them more successful. I am looking for a system that will draw more business to us as a team, but I feel responsible for their incomes, that is what motivates me. To tell you the truth….the more I read about the system I feel like it is stuff I am already trying to implement for my agents. Maybe not all aspects but a lot of them….I just don’t want to be stalked to buy products all the time.
February 27th, 2007 at 3:09 pmSorry I was talking to Eric not Helen, my mistake.
February 27th, 2007 at 3:10 pmKimi the Commie
February 27th, 2007 at 3:20 pmFunny…..I thought that was the whole idea….someone said Craig’s not about how much he makes….but the quality of time he now spends with his family. He himself writes that before this program he didn’t have time for a family. I like making money…but not at the expense of my kids time. If managed well….you can have almost anything you want, but it is not worth anything without my family.
February 27th, 2007 at 3:29 pmKimi the Commie ! That’s funny ! However I happen to agree with Kimi the Commie. Sorry Kimi, you’ve got me on your side. I’m the target of all this anger here, so if you’re not up for it I understand, and I’ll go it alone ! I’ve had followers of “The System” ( from now on we’ll call them followers, Shills, Lacky’s and the like are such ugly terms )call me in this post; Lazy,Loser,Childish, etc. All because I stated my opinion that I didn’t like this program. Now more than one of the Poster’s have “admitted” that they were “encouraged” to post. Were they encouraged to call anyone who posts here that didn’t appreciate this system “loser”, or “lazy”. ? I also wonder from a company that is supposidly so great at marketing, why are they fueling this blog by having so many confrontational clients blog here. This blog is now #4 in a Google search of Craig Proctor. Does it fall under the category of any press is good press? I don’t think so. If anyone takes the time to read every post, it is clear that one side is being geniune and MOST of the other side is, let’s say, “biased”. I would have stopped posting after my first post, however I feel compelled to defend myself against the barrage of attacks on my character. When will you guys realize that the more you post, and the more you mention Craig Proctor, the higher this blog goes in the search engines. AND THIS IS REALLY IT FOR ME, I’m done with it. Last post for me. Take all the shots you want. I’ll check back and see what’s up, but I’m done with this non-sense. Helen, good luck selling those Lawn Gnomes. Kimi, you’re my favorite commie, and I mean that. I’m taking my rusty car now over to my second job at Burger Hutt to flip some fries. Good luck to you all ! Happy St. Patrick’s Day !!!
February 27th, 2007 at 3:54 pmI am another guy whos had his ebay listing pulled (even though a ton have been listed and sold since including some with a years worth of training with them). Anyway here is my experience with quantum leap.
February 28th, 2007 at 7:42 amI bought it in Jan of 06 and followed step by step the plan laid out in the program. Ads, 800numbers etc with very little results from it. Now mind you I am on Long Island which has a very savvy jaded client and customer base so after a few months I decided to try the success websites.
First I went with the branded site and a fairly heavy pay per click ad campaign (for me anyway) of about $400-600 a month and it was generating nothing but bills from google and yahoo.
So realizing what type of prospect I was dealing with I switched to the unbranded site and upped the pay per click revenue and the leads started pouring in.
Great! finally I can be like all the guys who come on the “free” conference calls to tell me about all the millions there making man o man was I excited.
Then a funny thing happened, as I started calling the leads (at least the ones who gave me a number) I soon discovered that for the most part they were all crap. There is a REASON they opt in to an unbranded site. They just want to glom the free info without dealing with anyone and just becuase you now have there contact information there opinion hasnt changed.
So, all that being said in the course of a year I did generate about 290 leads at a cost of (including the web site) 8-10 grand.
My conversion rate on those leads were less then 1% becuase for the most part they are CRAP. I did do enough buisness to cover all my costs and make a little on but it was hardly worth the excercise. So I have pulled the plug on the site this month cancelled all the pay per click and will regroup my marketing campaign.
Now I am not a big shot agent I am only in the business less then 2 years and I did just under 8 mill in gcc last year but only about 500k of that was becuase of Quantum Leap.
I think in other parts of the country where people arent so much like crazy New Yorkers you can probably do better.
I did get tired of the constant hawking of wares on the conference calls, I would sometimes get called 2-3x a week to try to get me to go to the super conference.
I think the end game is to get you to invest about 25 grand to get all the information and training that is available and for me that just isnt going to happen.
Also I find alot of the marketing materials a bit dated to the mid 90’s example telling people your going to put listings in the mail from them when everyone and their mother has an idx link on there site not to mention the mls boards national sites etc. Some of that dated marketing might go over with old folks who dont own a computer but not with the people I am dealing with. So the bottom line is it can work, it has worked well for some and not for others but It is very market dependent and you better be ready to spend a hell of a lot more then 800 bucks to find out. Oh by the way if anyone wants mine just reply with an email and I will get back to you.
Oh 1 correction it was 8 mill in sales not gcc lol
February 28th, 2007 at 7:44 amSo this post got interesting. What I don’t get is why those that claim to have done well with the system have attacked Ken (the other one) and others that clearly didn’t find the system to be worth the money. Any child can call names, try posting some useful facts.
Here are some. I purchased the system, the call capture, went to the conference, purchased ads, the whole nine yards and made nothing…not a penny in return. After dropping as much money as I did I should have had at least $100k in returns based on my expected marketing ROI.
I am very good at converting leads, the problem was there weren’t any leads to follow up with. Classifieds are dead and have been for years. The Proctor website is a joke and doesn’t provide what a ready prospect wants. People looking for real estate on the web want one thing, LISTINGS.
Anyways people save your money and go buy the book “The Millionaire Real Estate Agent” by Gary Keller and you will have a better system laid out for you from a $20 book then Craig Proctor will ever put in front of you. The extra money you saved can cover your car payment for the next year or two.
February 28th, 2007 at 10:23 amO.K., when more, but this is it ! Thanks Ken ! You know that Ken means handsome…my mom told me that. And Rich, I filed what’s called a Counter Notice thru Ebay. You can get it through the Vero department. The company has 14 days to file an injunction against you or ebay “allows” you to relist it. I believe that I had every right to sell this item, as I was never told at any point I was buying a License only. You do what you feel is best for you, but if they start filing lawsuits against everyone selling this on Ebay Craigs going to be sueing someone every week. At last check there were 3 for sale on Ebay, and about 10 that sold in the last 3 weeks. I’m sure all satisfied customers who just didn’t want all the clutter around the house. Good luck.
February 28th, 2007 at 11:52 amKen if you would be so kind please post the result of the counter notice when you get a decision. It’s infuriating to see all the other systems being sold on ebay including one right now thats over $1700.00 with a years worth of training materials.
Ken Smith, I have had that book sitting on my shelf unread for over a year, I think I’ll crack it open right now.
February 28th, 2007 at 5:36 pmHi Rich,
I filed the counter-notice, they didn’t respond, Ebay put my auction back up and the item is sold. That’s how it works in America. It’s easy to “say” that this is a licsensed item, and then, in my opinion, illegally and randomly cause legitimate autctions to be terminated. Then not respond to the person trying to sell the item, only sending a single e-mail stating the item is copyrighted and not for resale. Well duh !( as my daughter would say a year or so ago when it was fashionable to say it ) Virtually everything produced these days is copyrighted and patented. That doesn’t mean it can’t be resold by the original purchaser. I was not told I was buying a license, I received no information in my package about this being a license or not being able to resell it. None whatsoever. If you were made aware of it Rich then you may have a problem. ( although I don’t think so, because the kind of control they are attempting here I don’t believe is legal. You can’t control the secondary market, and since this isn’t software of any kind, I think they’d have a hard time both proving that they are making their customers aware that THEY consider this a license to use and not a purchase, and also that they made every effort to let the consumer know that they were buying a liscense to use only. I also wonder what the conditions of this so called license to use might be? Can they revoke it? Can they just claim their was another piece of paper in the box that stated the liscense to use was only for 1 year? or 3 years, and has to be renewed. Sounds crazy but the first time I heard anything about a license was when my auction to sell it was pulled. Rich, did they ever mention a license to use only when you bought yours? Was one in the package? If I were you I’d file the counter notice. But that’s up to you. Good Luck.
March 1st, 2007 at 5:11 amNo they never mentioned any licensing at all do you have the link to file the counter-notice I was having a hard time finding it. I can find the link to file but not to counter.
Thanks
March 1st, 2007 at 1:40 pmHi Rich,
It wasn’t a link. What I had to do was go to Ebay support and ask for a counter notice form to be e-mailed to me. If you still have the notice that ebay sent you stating that your auction was removed you can probably reply to that. As a last resort check out another ebayer that goes under the name of Tabberone. You can also check ebay blogs under VERO. Tabberone is the one who advised me to do the counter notice. She has done it many times against BIG companies who pulled her listings. She always sues first and then files the counter notice. She has everything detailed on her ebay store site. I think it’s called Tabby’s something. But check under Tabberone. She calls it Tabby’s Hall of Shame. She details all the letters she’s received, all the suits she has filed, including all her correspondences with the CEO’s of these larger corporations. She makes clothes from fabric she buys that often have cartoon characters and such on them. These companies claimed that she couldn’t use their characters on her clothes and pulled her listings. She’s won in court around 15 times. That’s what got me to get off my butt and file the counter notice. Not only does you listing get pulled but you get a black mark on you Ebay record that doesn’t get removed unless you file the counter notice or the VeRO ( verified rights owner) removes the complaint. I was getting ready to open my Ebay store, so I couldn’t have this on my record. No one knows if they suspend your account after 2 complaints, or 3 or 5. So you don’t want them there, especially if you are sure you did nothing wrong. Good Luck !
March 1st, 2007 at 2:01 pmRich I don’t care what level your business is at the book will help you.
March 1st, 2007 at 2:07 pmI will get the counter notice form today. In the meantime I have listed it on amazon so if anyone is interested click here.
March 2nd, 2007 at 5:43 amThanks guys…..all the info I have read has made my decision easy. I am not buying the system. I do not have the capitol to keep investing and I do not want to be hounded everyday to buy the next step. I only have time to read this thread every 3rd day or so. I mean really, if I just spent the money they want on the ads I already know are working then I would be fine. Oh, yeah…..Ken S. I would like to go this weekend and get the book you mentioned. Something that gives me a fresh perspective is all I was looking for to begin with. I feel like I am a good agent and will do better with experience and feel it is important to keep educating yourself to be the best in your trade. From the very start I felt like I could find a smater way to work and not be a slave away from my family. But I do not feel like being a slave to a system and sales pitches either. Reading this thread has opened my eyes to the fact that I know myself well enough that I would just stay irritated if I had to deal with that during my time away from the office. I truly love Real Estate and do not mind the clients that call before 7A.M or after 8P.M But I have zero tolerance for sales calls during my time at home.
March 2nd, 2007 at 9:01 amThanks again for your helpful comments.
Kimi (far from a commie)
Kimi The Millionaire Real Estate Agent was written after interviewing hundreds of the nations top agents. We are talking about agents doing hundreds of transactions.
They break down your business into levels and it shows you how to keep advancing to the next one. Shows you the critical hires you need to make to keep advancing, how to lay out your business plan, and so much more.
I have talked with a lot of agents that have read the book and they all get something different out of it. Each time I read the book again there is something different that stands out. The reason for this is your business is always at a different level so you take what you need at that time.
March 2nd, 2007 at 9:42 amSounds exactly what I am looking for. I am just starting my own Brokerage and am looking for good Support for myself and my agents. I feel like they need to know I want to invest in their success.
March 2nd, 2007 at 10:19 amAny helpfull advise is always welcome.
wow what a forum. Lets clear up a few things that original call that jim or ken wrote about I was on it. or should I say I was on the correct call. He has several calls per day and I think what happenned is you got on a different call. So, you would be correct that the information you got would have been wrong. They give you a chance to ask questions on these calls you should have taken advantage of that and you would have realized he didnt “lie”. Yes he has people going on listing appointments and buyer appointments for him for the simple fact that when you sell 400-500 homes a year you have to have “leverage” you cant do everything yourself. He still makes calls and speaks to clients. That is partially why his system is so good because he IS STILL SELLING REAL ESTATE. He makes more money selling real estate the he does with the super conference. The system is solid. I dont know of another system that you can make as much money and work less. The services that are offered are not offered at an inflated price. He is just offering the same service that he uses so you can you use his system. There is no next step Craig offers an a-z real estate system he plugs his seminar on the call because the conference call is just a tiny tid bit of what his system really does. the bottom line if you want to make 7 figures in real estate this is the guy to talk to. the millionaire real estate agent is right along the lines of what proctor does as well its a great book but it just gives you guidlines. I use craigs system and I went from consistantly carrying 6 listings and now carry about 30 I am in the Los Angeles area and can answer any question regarding his system. There is no other system that can deliver the massive results that the Quantum leap system.
March 2nd, 2007 at 12:47 pmI am shocked at this blog. I am new to real estate (very new). I have been with ReMax for 1 month. I saw the ad for Craig Proctor’s system in the Realtor Mag. & was very interested so I thought that I would read a little about Craig & his system before I spent more money. Does the system work & is it good for a new agent? All I have been doing lately is writing checks & have not had one deposit (do to no transactions). I’m at a lost & have kids to feed! If anyone has any advice or if the system really does work please let me know the truth! As I said, I don’t have much money but if the system works - my American Express is already paying my bills now so it can handle one more charge. Give advice. Thanks!!!!!
March 4th, 2007 at 4:27 pmTammy it produces mixed results. But it can and does obviously work for some better then others. You can read my expreience above and then read others that have had better and worse results.
If you want to try it you can buy mine on amazon for alot less then it will cost you new and if it doesnt work out for you sell it on Ebay for what you paid for it.
That reduces your risk to almost zero.
Good Luck
March 5th, 2007 at 5:05 amRich
Tammy….I am in quite the same position as you. But after reading up on Craig, I feel like my money would be well spent on advertising my business myself. I truly have count the cost and do not feel I can justify the money they are asking when I still will be doing a lot of the things I already do, plus more advertising. I am going to start advertising more and see what happens. If you would like to talk more, let me know and I will leave you my e-mail.
March 5th, 2007 at 10:46 amI have purchased the program, ran the ads EXACTLY how it said, purchased the hotline and the website, and have had some fairly poor results. I am going to re test it in the spring to see if that improves my relults, but so far this has just not delivered. I did attend one of the mini seminars’s 3 weeks ago in AZ. It was basically a half day version of the “Live” trainning calls. Huge sales pitch at the end etc. I am thinking of going to one of the superconferences this summer if the new testing produces more success. One thing I would like you all to try if you are thinking about purchasing the program (when I tried it it made me sick because it feels like I got cheated). Get on the “Live” calls, and get into the que to ask a question. It will not work. I know because I have been on about 15 and have tried to ask a question every time, never worked. Furthermore, in listening to all of these calls, they started to repeat themselves, A.K.A they are recordings. Very disheartoning.
Mark
March 6th, 2007 at 3:48 pmAlso, I am not by any means trying to bash the system, this is just MY account of things that happpened. I do know of an agent in Minnesota who uses the system with success. Trust me I pray that I am wrong when I try it again.
Mark
March 6th, 2007 at 4:23 pmTo Tammy:
So sorry to hear your frustration. Many Realtors who have bought Craig’s system complain about how expensive it is (esp with all the add-ons you have to keep buying and buying); I also know part of it is based on some outdated methods like classified ads and websites that could get you banned in the search engines. That is not to say an agent could not make money with it - there are agents who claim it works for them. But I think there are more effective and less expensive systems out there.
Just starting in the business can be tough and I am sure there are several systems that may work for you.
You might try Mike Ferry’s system - if you are strapped for cash, just get the script books rather than the coaching. The basic premise is that you call, knock doors, and network everywhere to drum up business. FSBOs and Expireds can be a great source of business. These techniques cost only your time.
When you do have some funds, you could try the Millionaire Real Estate Agent strategies. Farm mailings and other things can be very effective over time. And there are alot of other GOOD systems that won’t break your wallet.
And don’t forget the MOST important thing: a great, lead-generating, search-engine-friendly website - for only $97 per month, you can have a Famous Blogsite (shameless plug).
March 6th, 2007 at 6:29 pmThank you everyone. I’ve been in RE since August ‘06 (what great timing eh?) and have sold one whole house. YeeHaa! Anyway, I’ve listened in on Craig’s calls and yes they are obviously canned. I get daily emails about the calls and superconferences yada yada yada, just the kind of salesperson I don’t want to be. I do have the Keller book and have read bits and pieces. Guess it’s time to read it cover to cover and use it as my Bible.
Has anyone worked for the likes of ZipRealty or any of the other website centered brokers that say they give you 2-5 leads a day? I’d love to hear about others experiences with that business model. Oooh, maybe this isn’t the right forum for that?
Anyway Tammi & Kimi, I think your idea about money in advertising instead of more really expensive training makes sense.
Good luck to all of us!
March 6th, 2007 at 6:41 pmHolly
The bottom line is this is a friend making business, network make enough friends, have the guts to chase fsbos and expireds mail a farm and service like a mad man and with a little luck you will build a referal base. If you can do that you can make it. There is a reason that on average only 40 out of 1000 people who get there real estate license are still in the business 5 years later. And becuase of that there are zillions of so called “trainers” and people with systems out there selling suckers like us hope.
March 7th, 2007 at 5:05 amDid you ever notice the top producers in your office are for the most part referral agents. Do you really think people who always have 10-20 listings are going to “superconferences” would you?
Anyway nice group of people in here and I wish us ALL the best of luck in this nutty business.
Someone earlier mentioned Mike Ferry. Does anyone have a comment on his program?
I do pretty good in sales and have considered one of these coaching programs to not only reinforce what’s known but to be held accountable and given that necessary push from time to time. In this slow market, it’s easy to get lazy. I just got off the 1pm call with Craig and felt it was too canned so tend to agree more with all the other comments on this blog.
Holly mentioned lead companies. Stay away from them especially if they have you pay upfront. Holly, you need to take advantage of the slow market and attend classes at your board. Hopefully your Broker provides training too. If not, you may want to find one that will…you do give them money, make them earn it too. If you plan on advertising, be prepared to track your advertising dollar. IF anyone calls you, first question, “How did you hear about me”. I can almost promise you it won’t be from an ad. In RE the business will not come to you…you have to go get it. There is no such thing as an easy buck in this field. Spend the money on education, get your GRI. Get out in the world and let everyone know you are in RE and ask your friends and family to spread the word and bring you business. The one house you sold is your start…have that person send you business. You have to ask for the business. It will come but you have to want it.
March 7th, 2007 at 1:17 pmI just finished going through all the blogs here and I have a question. Craig obviously sells several different programs that all build on one another. Does one really have to buy everything in order to be successful (The basic course, the seminar, the coaching, the Platinum program, are there others?) Is it unrealistic to expect to buy the basis course and succeed without going any further?
I am convinced that the material is worthwhile, but I don’t have unlimited funds. Should I look elsewhere?
Thanks.
March 8th, 2007 at 11:58 amI am thankful for all the advice I have recieved by readying this blog. I am like Holly, I started in Aug. ‘06. I really love this business and I don’t want to have to haggle and beg to make it. I have sold 8 properties, with things just now starting to pick back up. I like trying to keep about 5 or 6 deals in my pipeline at a time.( I don’t feel experienced enough for more than that yet.) Word of mouth has been my best source of business thus far. I also have found a new home business that is awsome that helps me sustain between closings. I am a very big skeptic because I have spent a lot of money when I was younger trying to find that perfect home business. Now that I found it I truly get to do the things that I want to. I sell real estate, have time for my children and grandchildren, Plus me and my husband can travel and do some of the things I was not able to do before. Being a very domestic woman, I didn’t ever feel right about having a 9-5 job away from home and kids. Now I have everything I want and am getting to pursue Real Estate also.
March 8th, 2007 at 12:24 pmAnyone interested in learning my tricks can contact me at kimiroyer@hotmail.com
I have a truley wonderful life and found it by making sure that I investigated every thing I did and then prayed about it earnestly.
THANK YOU CRAIG, MY BUSINESS TRIPLE SINCE I STARTED USING YOUR PROGRAM AND FOR THE MONEY THAT I PAID FOR IT IT’S NOTHING I GOT MY MONEY WORTH THOUSANDS TIME
March 8th, 2007 at 3:29 pmHolly-
Regarding buying internet leads, I don’t recommend it. We did it in the beginning and they were terrible leads.
I don’t know anything specific about Zip (and feel free to talk about anything G-rated and real estate related here).
I just had dinner with a Realtor friend who worked for another real estate company that gave him leads. The leads were so bad that he is now earning a living as an EMT. I guess that gives you a good picture, huh?
March 8th, 2007 at 11:44 pmLouise-
Great post. Thanks for the good advice. Yes, getting business the hard way (talking to folks on the phone or at their door… ahhhhh) is tough, but it does bring in business quickly.
And other things take time such as farming and getting your website to the top of the search engines — but, these things really pay off down the road.
I agree with your recommendation on education. This is absolutely necessary - both for bettering ourselves and for serving our clients better.
March 8th, 2007 at 11:49 pmRegarding Mike Ferry - my husband went from another new licensee to a man with several (sold) listings fairly quickly with this system when he first started in the business. Yes, he cold-called and door-knocked and visited expireds and FSBOs. (Not exactly my cup of tea, but then that’s what makes me a better buyer’s agent and a great support for him.)
You can do it on your own, but it’s nice to have the tried and true scripts. You can also find someone in your office to “role-play” the scripts with you.
Similar scripts are also available from several different books and trainers as well.
March 8th, 2007 at 11:55 pmRelating to the Craig Proctor cronies, fans, obligated customers, etc. that have posted on this blog (likely because Craig asked you to)…
I thought about picking apart all the rude, unprofessional, and moronic comments many of the Proctor fans made here — but I’ve decided otherwise.
I do want to thank Barb Schlinker, Ralph Wiber, and Bryan Pellican for posting a professional comment about your personal experience with Craig Proctor’s systems and for not stooping to “childish” levels just because others did not have the same experience or may disagree.
Jim and I appreciate your thoughts and thank you for maintaining those ethical standards all of us Realtors are supposed to hold dear.
March 9th, 2007 at 12:09 amAnd thanks to Rich for the insightful and factual post about your experience with Craig’s sytem.
And thanks to Ken Smith for bringing us all back on point about what clients really want (for those who don’t know, Ken Smith is a highly intelligent & very successful Realtor - not someone who didn’t know how to use the system correctly).
And thanks to Ken (the other one) for being such a good sport amongst the conflict. You are my hero and I have enjoyed reading your thought-provoking and humorous posts.
(Sorry, I’m playing catch-up because I’ve been away for a family emergency. I’ll stop now lest I feel like I’m winning a grammy and have to say thanks again…)
March 9th, 2007 at 12:18 amAndrea,
Thanks for the support !
I’ll agree with you on Ralph, as he stated his opinion without degrading those that didn’t like the system, and didn’t seem to have an agenda. If you look back Andrea, Bryan P. added at the end of his post that “this system will work if you are SMART ENOUGH and willing to WORK HARD enough”. In other words, if this system didn’t work for you then your are stupid and/or Lazy. I don’t find that constructive, do you? ( If you don’t see the kings clothes then you must be an idiot.) I’m neither an idiot nor lazy, and I found this system to be exactly as I described it above. Now Barb I’m on the fence on, but it concerns me that she mentioned at the end about the 30 day money back guarantee and that she did receive the paper saying you can’t resell it. First off, the aforementioned piece of paper (Liscense agreement) doesn’t say you can’t resell it. It states that this information ” is not to be shared with non-members”. Which is fair in my opinion. Completely uninforceable, but fair. In other words they don’t want a broker buying it and making copies for any agent that wants one. ( I’m sure it happens, but I’m assuming that is what Craig was trying to avoid ) However even IF the “License Agreement” stated that you can’t resell it, I don’t believe he could prevent you from doing it anyway. You can’t over-ride the “First Sale Doctrine” by inventing your own “law”. My opinion, but I think it’s completely valid. Last point, she also stated that Craig “does honor his 30 day money back guarantee”. How does Barb know this? I’m not saying he doesn’t, I’m sure he does, but how does she know this? Hmmmmmm I might be getting a bit picky on Barb, but if she wrote that his does “offer” this guarantee, that would make sense. Unless she answers the phones at customer service over there, or knows someone who did return it, she doesn’t KNOW anything about what they do or don’t honor. ( however I’m sure he does. Problem is there is so much info. here, and phone calls to go in on, and ads to place, and phone lines to buy, it would be almost impossible in my opinion to decide in that amount of time if it’s going to work for you. )
Anyway, I know where your heart was Andrea, so thanks. But I think even if we give Barb the benefit of the doubt here, Bryan P. can’t be included as posting professionally when he considers those who didn’t like the system to not be smart or not willing to work hard.
Anyone know how to unsubscribe from this ? I’ve cliced the e-mails about 10 times and then I get another message about this post. “every time I think I’m out they keep pulling me back in ! ”
take care all.
March 9th, 2007 at 9:30 amKen
Very true, Ken. I’ll give you that one on Brian P’s last sentence. It did imply an attitude, which he should not have done. I was just so thrilled he didn’t stoop the the others’ level that I thanked him for that. So… aside from your last sentence, Bryan, thanks for being professional in your post.
And I understand what you are saying about the 30 day guarantee. Sounds like a joke - as an example, some ads require 30 days in advance to run! If Craig’s system is really that great, he’d allow folks time to test it properly.
March 9th, 2007 at 12:08 pmthere seems to be alot of speculation on this blog. To all the NEW agents. the craig proctor system works! bottom line. there are 1000’s of agents making 6-7 figures with this system. if you you tried it and it didnt work its not the system it is you. Classified ads are not out dated. I advertise there all the time and I get a ton of leads. I have been on those conference calls and I have gotten through I know many people who have gotten through. If anyone has questions on this system I ask you to call me or email me, especially if you are having trouble with the system. I have put alot of effort into it and have figured it out. it is very easy to do. The one thing that most people on this blog dont realize is that craig proctor has an entire Real Estate system, from what ads to run, to how to market your properties get price reductions, write offers, hire agents hire staff, and what tools to use to do it with, does mike ferry do that? is ferry even selling real estate? NO. Craig still has an office and he still sells real estate over 500 houses a year doing exactly what everyone here is saying doesnt work. He shows you how to build a team and a business! so you can sell a riduculouse amount of houses. If your a new agent this is the perfect system for you because your not contaminated with “the way things are currently being done” I have expireds, FSBOS and foreclosure listings calling me. My entire client base calls me first. (how many of you would like that) Nobody hanging up the phone on you and everyone waiting for you to call them back, yeah its nice. I get about 150 calls a day and I have a really tough market. I had my first listing from my website within the first 30 days which yeilded a 10,000 check. If you are running an ad that takes 30 days in advance to run you are running it in the wrong place and probably spending to much money. I spend a minimal amount on advertising and carry around 30 listings at any given time. The bottom line is the system works! there is MAJOR 7 figure proof that it does and no one can dispute that no matter what you say on this blog. if it doesnt work. maybe the system isnt for you. maybe working really hard and spending more time/money working IN your business and not at home with your family or doing somthing fun is your preference. If the system didnt work for you it is because you fell short of making it work it wasant the system!
March 12th, 2007 at 11:51 am150 lead calls a day huh. With that sort of incredible volume I am sure you wouldnt mind disclosing your office to us would you? Im sure all of us “losers who should be doing something else” would love to hear how you average 6.25 leads per hour every hour of the day 365 days a year. Who needs Craig Proctor? we need the Frank system!
March 12th, 2007 at 1:40 pm150 lead calls per day is certainly an outrageous and unbelievable claim (notice I didn’t say it wasn’t true - just unbelievable). I think it’s important to track how many leads translate to closed sales. And what your GCI to net ratio is.
Increasing volume or GCI means nothing if your expenses aren’t in line or your net income doesn’t increase (with ANY system).
March 12th, 2007 at 2:34 pmI agree with Andrea, if you are spending 20 grand on PPC to make the 150 calls and considering the average conversion rate of a lead being 3-5% (Ok May be 10% on the phone if you are good). Still I would love to hear the cost of the 150 calls.
March 12th, 2007 at 6:51 pmRich the brokerage is Pinnacle, 9137 Reseda Blvd. North Ridge, CA 91326.
So you only carry 30 listings at a time, yet have 150 calls per day or 4500 per month. To carry 30 listings in a slow-average market means you only list about 8-12 per month which isn’t that many. If the market is really hot then you are averaging 20 or so listings per month, but you aren’t in a hot market (family in the area).
To get only 10 listings per month from 4500 leads is pathetic, that is a conversion of only .002%. You are either lying or need some serious coaching on how to convert leads.
March 12th, 2007 at 7:11 pm150 leads a day sounds pretty high. One of the top agents in our area that uses the CP system may not even get that!
30 listings is a LOT of listings.
I’m primarily an I.T. guy, I just recently started using the CP system.
To me it comes down to this simply.
I can make 200 phone calls on internet leads to generate one sale
OR
I can make 10 phone calls (for a much higher cost per lead) to generate at least one sale.
I’m kind of liking the CP side of things.
Ken,
Seems that you may be an angry individual. It also looks like Rich may have inflated his numbers. Shame, shame.
Here’s how I know Rich isn’t telling everything.
If he has that many leads AND is using the CP system, then his conversion SHOULD be much higher.
See with the CP system your cost per lead may go up but your quality of leads goes up too!
No one could handle 4500 leads on their own. So he’s either:
A. Lying
March 13th, 2007 at 7:43 amB. Needs Coaching (we all do)
C. Has very poor lead quality
D. Lying
E. Trying to convert them all by himself
F. All of the above.
Josh, I think you missed the point. The point that I believe Rich was making is that Frank is lying. At that rate you would have 10,000 leads in 2 1/2 months! Are there even that many people looking for to buy or sell in his market at one point in time? It’s insane.
As for your post, your pitch that “we all need coaching” sounds like you’re doing what so many of the people posting here are afraid will happen if they buy this system, that they will get pitched to buy more and more programs, websites and “coaching”.
I think we need to make it RULE #1 that anyone who was “asked” to post state that right in the beginning of their post. It’s pretty obvious anyway, but at least they’ll know they’re not fooling anyone here.
March 13th, 2007 at 1:09 pmIm not lying you guys really need to read the post before you comment. I didnt say I got 150 lead a day I get 150 calls a day and that is an average any one who can guarantee they get that many calls a day is a god. My conversion rate is pretty good. I have the luxury of not having to scratch a claw for business and I am in the CP program. My listings fluxuate between 25-35 on average this second I just closed 3 properties and I have 26. The address to my office is correct and my number is 818-263-7265 feel free to come by or call me with any questions if you doubt craig proctors system or my numbers. I dont know who quoted the loser thing but that wasant me. I bought most of craigs systems that someone said where over priced and I have already hit 6 figures and I plan on doing 7 figures this year. Ken is pretty quick drag other people down, how much did you sell last year? and where is your market. why didnt proctor work for you. I bet I could tell you why if you disclose the problems you had, call me. I am posting here beacause I do not believe you gave the craig proctor system a fair deal and may be influencing people that may truly benifit from it.
March 13th, 2007 at 1:50 pmMy opinion of why it didn’t work is because it’s not that great. I didn’t see any great revalations here. I found much of the program silly to be quite frank. I don’t see how you can call someone who calls in asking for a pamphet about “27 ways to sell their home on their own” as a “hot lead” . This is a cold lead. When you call this person, who didn’t leave their number, but whose number you “captured” on you 800 line service, they don’t want you to be calling them, they didn’t ask for you to call, and they are looking to sell on their own. When I want to call FSBO’s I could buy the newspaper for 35 cents and call them. I don’t need to run ads to get them to call for free information, then capture their number on my stealth 800 line. I’m now paying for the ad and the 800 line, when I could get the lead just as easy when they advertise in the local paper. Why spend all this money running ads and paying for 800 numbers ? These are not hot leads, at least not to me. When I’m calling someone and I know they don’t want to be called by me, that lead is cold. Do yourselves a favor, spend the $800 on farming an area for a year. At least when you get the 1% return you’ll be calling people back that left their phone number and want to speak to you.
As for my numbers from last year, let’s just say I’m one of the “losers” that can’t compare to your 7 figure income. I’ll tell you what though, IF/WHEN I do make 7 figures, I’ll certainly find better things to do with my time and money than to blog here. If Craig didn’t play games with my E-bay auction I would never have bothered with this. At least I have a reason to be here. Get a life.
March 13th, 2007 at 6:09 pmJoshua,
Learn to read a thread before you go insulting people genius. I was responding to Franks outrageous claim, if you read the blog I gave a very detailed account of my experience earlier.
March 14th, 2007 at 3:22 amI actually posted an apology but I guess it didn’t “stick.”
It FRANK not Rich, my apologies.
KEN,
I don’t have a problem with your opinion, I have a problem with the way you present it. You can say, “It didn’t work for me, I didn’t like the way it was presented, it felt like a scam, they’ve made it difficult for me to get my money back from this…”
But, your post seem pretty anger filled. If there was any doubt, the “get a life” post would suffice as evidence of that. Taken as its posted, I would assume that everyone here has no life. What’s next, are you going to talk about my “mamma?”
I’m baffled that you would call the leads a cold lead. How is the editorial ads any different than asking for someone to enter their information in online to get access to the MLS then calling them the next day.
If as an agent you only call those people who actually want you to call them, then you’d only be calling past clients, friends and family.
March 14th, 2007 at 4:09 amAll of the info I receive in the mail from CP is outdated. I received the internet info yesterday and all of the comments are 5+ years old. They just changed the amounts from “I made $144000 per year off my webiste” to ($1,500,000). I am not saying it doesn’t work but at least send out some current information. I bought the system back in August ‘06 and the info etc was from the 90’s. All the services are he recommends are way over-priced. Who really pays 20 cents per minute for 800 calls etc? Price gougers (sp?) Everything service offered you can get for and average of 75% cheaper anywhere else.
March 14th, 2007 at 5:17 pmI do like the listing presentation and it has worked well. Has anyone had experience with the buyers presentation?
I have a page or two of the buyers presentation in my book and same for the listing presentation. In general I found that I was able to come up with a much better presentation then the canned one from CP.
March 14th, 2007 at 6:27 pmto all of you whose not satified with cp program maybe you need stop waisting time writing about your experience and get out there and find an other way to make money because if you can make the cp work you do not need to be in real estate go get a 9 to 5 job you will be better off. I am currently carring a total of 45 listing and 10 pending in a slow market and that because I am using just the $ 800 pg and I didn’t have to buy anything else because it was enough for me to double my business. So to all of you not satified real estate is not for you get another job!
March 14th, 2007 at 7:05 pmMardy,
First, Prove it! I am always skeptical of an anonymous poster.
Second, your suggestion that someone should get out of the real estate business because they didn’t like the Craig Proctor System is immature and absurd.
I know many agents that do quite a bit more business than you “claim” to be doing that are not using Craig’s System. Perhaps you should go get a nine-to-fiver! See how ridicules that sounds?
Third, here is a book recommendation for you: How to Win Friends & Influence People by Dale Carnegie
March 14th, 2007 at 9:06 pmhmmm I think that I just might be one of those agents
. To think the Craig Proctor system didn’t work for me, guess I should go get a 9-5 job and forget about the 30+ transactions I have pending…not.
March 14th, 2007 at 9:14 pmHey Ken, (Ken Smith)
If I ever find a 9-5 job that pays what I make now, I might just quit toot sweet…
March 14th, 2007 at 9:23 pmKen,
I stand behind everything I said anyone here wants to come to my office or call me please feel free. I have had many agents come see my business that Craig Proctor Has helped me and is CONTINUING to Help me build to see that I am 100% legit. as far as anything else you said, I think everyone here see’s you for what you are and I am not going to make any further comments about what you have said. Good luck to you in the future.
Updated by Admin: We offered to take Frank up on his offer “to come to his office” and he has remained silent since. That’s a clear answer to me…
March 15th, 2007 at 8:55 amBoys, now let’s play nice. I’ve got a question for any of the above agents that have had success with the Proctor system. Without breaking your license agreement, tell the forum what in the system you buy for $800 is so great? I’m not being a smart alec this time. Someone mentioned that even without purchasing websites and 800 services and coaching that the system as it stands alone could double your income . ( something like that.) I didn’t see it myself. I couldn’t use the presentation, as I wasn’t doing the tour of homes, I couldn’t get the information from my MLS to show my strong areas, etc. Now Craig has a huge track record as we all know. But you take all his great numbers out of the presentation and there’s not much left in my opinion. In other words, if you’re not great to begin with there isn’t much there to use. ( especially if you DON’T buy the 800 lines and website.) So for me that was basically useless. ( I’m happy with my presentation anyway, so that wasn’t such a big deal ) But just tell me a couple of “ideas” that were so earth shattering that it was worth $800 + . I just didn’t see it. I’m very curious to see if there is something I just missed. It wouldn’t be the first time.
March 15th, 2007 at 9:14 amFrank,
FamousAgents.com will take you up on your offer. Either Andrea or myself will come to your office and verify the claims you have made and review the system in a working environment.
You claim that you receive 150 calls per day on average. We will “shadow” you for three days in order to establish a fair average.
At the end of the three days we will write a complete evaluation as to where your leads come from, how many you actually receive, business volume, etc.
It should make for a great article. If your claims are factual, you and Craig both should receive quite a bit of traffic from our site.
Keep in mind, that the original topic was not whether or not the system works, it was that Craig lied in an email (spam) regarding what he would deliver on a call.
However, the commenters have chosen to move the topic to the actual value of the system.
I look forward to your reply. This should be enlightening for all. Let’s get it scheduled!
Jim
March 15th, 2007 at 9:15 amKen,
March 15th, 2007 at 9:41 amGo back and carefuly review all the info in the first package you receive and just use one of them for 30 days you will get result and your $ 800 back But you nedd to read the program.
Jim,
What a great idea! I think the odds of it happening are about the same as an ice sculpting contest in hell but just in case I am wrong about that I would LOVE to see the results.
March 15th, 2007 at 10:32 amI don’t know if this is posting in the right order, as I received a response from Mardy, but it’s not showing up in this blog. However, Mardy wrote to me that I should go back and do the 30 day program etc.etc. and that I will see results and get my $800 back pretty quick. Mardy, I already tried the program for a good 6 months. I don’t have it anymore. What I was asking was for someone to state something in the $800 system, that didn’t require buying anything else, that is so great to be worth $800. That’s all. This should be a golden opportunity for those lauding the C.P. program to “sell it ” back to me and anyone else. I forget who responded to my comment about the leads from the stealth ads being cold, but for the record I think calling someone who doesn’t want to be called is the definition of a cold lead. ( o.k., maybe a cool lead, since they are obviously interested in Real estate if they asked for the info. ) I did try the ads. Only one response from maybe a few dozen ads placed. I can’t justify continuing to place ads with no return. My opinion is that their is so much information available on the internet that people have most of the information they need at their fingertips. Around here I also believe that people understand that when they call and request “free” information that they are being set up for phone calls they don’t want. Same reason I don’t click on pop up ads or enter my e-mail for a chance to win a free flat screen T.V. Even though it doesn’t cost anything, I know I’m going to get canvased if I do it.
March 15th, 2007 at 11:06 amCan someone please tell me how to stop getting this “alerts” about this blog. Everytime someone sneezes I get notified. I tried removing myself, like 9 times ! I still want to check back, but I don’t need to know hourly updates ! Help me !
Ken,
If you are subscribed to comments you will see a “manage your subscriptions” link at the bottom of the comment box.
I believe that subscribe to comment updates is checked by default. Be sure to remove the check mark when you submit a new comment or else you will be re-subscribed.
I deleted your subscription and this is the response:
kentonks[@]patmedia.net is not subscribed to any posts on this site.
Also, if you are not seeing a comment or post that you know has been added you need to refresh the page. Your browser is pulling its cached version of the page. It’s a good habit to hit the refresh button twice on any page that you frequently visit on any website. Once will refresh text. However, it takes two to update images.
March 15th, 2007 at 12:17 pmBefore I get on my soap-box about the R-E business & Craig Proctor in general, I want to say that I agree about the tele-calls.
Big promises with nothing in return but a testomony & how well so and so is doing from CPs course. Then it’s sells-pitch time.
Typical marketing.
I’ve learned 1 thing in 5 years of this crappy business, beside the fact that the R-E business is a joke!
It’s all about word of mouth, & referrals from friends, past clients, & people you know. There is no magic pill or “system” that will turn you into a mega-agent.
Those few who are mega-agents, got lucky, & started by having contacts & actually knowing people. They also had some money for working capital to run all these ads, & pay for all these expenses, & pay for all that postage/farming.
My 1st year in the business, I spent $14,000 more than I made! All on advertising from image ads to schemes of buy a house through me & get something for free, to mail-outs.
I finally was able to track where all my business has came from.
95% from referrals, friends, word of mouth.
5% (or less) on calls from listings & converting them to buyers of other properties.
Per what i’ve been told by several brokers within our company & 1 of the owners, I was doing okay & ahead of the national average for how long i’d been in the business till ‘06.
Each year my numbers was up & up. Multi-Million Dollar producer, yada, yada, yada.
‘06 I only made $21,000 in commissions after split before expenses.
I have NOT had a pay check since November ‘06. FINALLY got a listing on Monday that was a referral from a friend.
My point to all this rambling is it’s a crappy line of work and it’s gonna continue to get worse. I don’t know about your state but here, they hand out R-E license like candy @ a parade. What really yanked my chain was the cashier in Wal-Mart that had a license as well as another clerk.
The market is flooded, more people walking around with an RE license than there is business.
Luckly I know someone 4 hours away who is a mega-agent (closed 40 million in transactions last year) and he is gonna let me borrow his Craig-Proctor system/course for FREE!
However, his exact words to me was,
“Ronnie I know your having money problems. If you go by what he says you’ll be spending $5,000 a month that I know you don’t have. I got a couple ideas from it but he is teaching things I was already doing like the trade program & sale gaurantee. All my business has came from people I know & networking. It’s cheap and inexpensive. Heck I grew-up in this town & know everyone in addition to all the politics i’m involved in”.
Even though I was “supposedly” doing well above the national average, the national average for someone in the R-E business between 5 to 10 years is only $57,000.
I don’t know about ya’ll but that isn’t sqwat when all the expenses & taxes are counted.
Heck I only made $63,000 in ‘05 & was starving then!
I’m awaiting this Craig Proctor course in the mail from my friend. I’ll read thru it, & let ya know if I gain anything from it. However my expectations are low.
My savings has run out & it’s time to find a JOB!
March 15th, 2007 at 1:31 pmRonnie if you like working based on referrals then you should look into the Brian Buffini Referral by Design system.
Jim I think that trip would be a great idea.
March 15th, 2007 at 9:03 pmI agree with a lot these posts. I have invested a ton of money since the conference in Chicago in July, 2006. After day 1 its a total waste of time. My partner and I left early on day 3 because they are just trying to sell all of their vendors products. I will say that I have picked up 4 listings in recent months, but they came from mailers, not Craig Proctor’s system. To give you some insight on what I have bought into, I have the branded and unbranded websites through a small company, not the one Proctor sells. I have talking house. AMS hotlines have not done a thing for me. Most people call, listen and then hang up (total waste of money for me). This whole idea of Proctor using robots, this, that and the other?? I dont know if it really works. I have increased my business, but I dont know if I could attribute it to Proctor. You have to understand that Proctor is a salesman and he is selling his product like any other salesperson. I have gone as far as running commercials on t.v. with his different programs. I ran an ad for 4 days on CBS with a viewership of over 15,000 people and did not get one call. Bad commercial? Bad times?? Hard to say, but the bottom line is they didn’t work. I have invested about 10k in the last 8 months and have not done any better using Proctor. I have found that knowing a lot of people has made me more money than Proctor. Oh well, I cant really say it is or isn’t working but my opinion is that it is one salesman selling his products to salesmen who think its some type of majic. I am contemplating joining the coaching program but its a lot of money. Then you join coaching and then they try to sell you on another program but I cant remember the name of it. Oh well, good luck. Any comments for this post would be appreciated.
March 15th, 2007 at 11:16 pmWell I just bought the system and have not recieved it yet but I do know of an agent who swears by it is number on agent in our city with about 1 million in GCI. And he follows the system to a tee. So for my sake I hope it does work. This agent by the way is hated by every one in the city, agents and clients. He has a bad reputation but he keeps outselling everyone. He attributes it to his lead generation.
March 16th, 2007 at 8:05 amWow! What a war going on here! All I can say is that I think that the Proctor system is good for generating leads. However, the Success web sites are not up to par. The web sites had a flaw up until about Nov. of 06. ANYBODY could type in “report” after the www(dot)my-domain.com/ and you could get access into ANY Success site. Now, I don’t know how many agents want their competition looking at their stats, but I for one don’t! But since that is fixed now, it is not an issue. The issue is, I did a lot of looking at the stats of numerous Success sites and the stats revealed that between 85 - 90% of the visitors were on the site for less than 30 sec! Furthermore, I heard that Craig Proctor wanted to disolve his agreement with Success, but they offered him more money to stay. The bottom line is, Craig does not even like the Success product.
March 16th, 2007 at 2:39 pmI’ve been following all this for a few days and I definitely will not be throwing my money towards CP at this time. But I got a wierd phone call at the office today from this lady trying to sell me referrals, their website is recr.com. She was trying to tell me she had a referral to sell me, and that the client wanted a house that cost 15x our local average. Is this another scam? Has anyone else ever dealt with these people? Are they even legit? I’m real new at this and I wasn’t aware agents paid for referrals outright. Can someone let me know what is normal?:)
March 16th, 2007 at 5:27 pmJeff,
We would be happy to review your system. If you would like us to review it just send a note to us via our contact page or call our 800 number listed at the top of the page.
Jim
March 18th, 2007 at 3:49 amThought I would add to this by saying I have had success with the system and it does offer lead generation. Many of the sales I have throughout the year come from my website and Craig’s System. It may not be for everyone or every market place however, I have to say I have been pleased.
March 19th, 2007 at 9:49 amJim,
Thanks dude. After I asked how to unsubscribe I was able to figure it out myself. I’m still here and checking the post, however I was getting so many “pot-shots” taken at me by the C.P. deciples I didn’t want the aggravation any more. Seems to have settled down now. Did Frank ever respond to your “offer”?
March 19th, 2007 at 1:03 pmKen said: Did Frank ever respond to your “offer”?
Not yet…
March 19th, 2007 at 1:33 pmWe have been using CRaigs system for over 2 years and went from one realtor selling 24 homese to 4 realtor team selling 94 the first year and 20 in Jan, Feb , and Mar. We dont use the succerss websites, we did some research and found some better. If you truly use the ideas of the system and get a little creative( god forbid you try ) this thing works like a champ.
March 27th, 2007 at 7:51 pmWalt,
You actually did better as one agent. You sold 24 homes in a year. As a team of 4 you are averaging 23.5 each. Not really all that impressive is it? And the most important question is what are your expenses?
March 27th, 2007 at 8:01 pmJim,
I was resisting the urge to beat the perverbial horse here, but your comments are laughable.
If he sold 24 homes in one year with an average commisssion of say 3% on an average sales price of 200K he made $144,000 GCI.
Conversly, even if he is very nice with his other agents by taking 25% on each deal and only does half the business himself he gets
12 Deals Himself $72,000
4 Agents at 25% Per Deal, 3% Commission, 200K Avg Sale Price - $123,000
TOTAL: $195,000
A modest increase of 35%. With a 50/50 split (traditional), Walt’s numbers are up to 246K plus his 72.
Again this is all hypothetical, but Jim’s comments are way off base. To take a single agent doing 24 homes to a whole team averaging almost the same is outstanding. It’s rare to add team members and get almost the same out of them (he said he added agents not admin staff).
March 28th, 2007 at 2:15 amWalt, what website did you find that was better? Can you give us the address of one of your websites to take a look at please.
March 28th, 2007 at 5:09 amHey Josh,
You may be right, but you are also assuming quite a bit in your analysis. One, what kind of production did they do before they formed a team and before implementing the C.P. system. Is the poster the broker?, I don’t believe he said that. And of course this is all great if the results can be verified.
Maybe Jim Messenger could offer to validate the numbers these agents were doing pre and post using the system? Again I think it’s been shown that many of the poster’s that are stating they have had such great success using the system were invited to post. Keep in mind if you read the whole blog that this fact was only disclosed after they were called to the mat on why they were posting and in particular why they were searching the internet under Craig Proctor if they were already using the system? And why back in Feb. did 4 people all post glowing results from this system within hours of each other? Did they all just happen onto the blog? It turns out they were contacted and asked to post.
The 30 day money back guarantee is nice, but I’m sure if someone were to stumble upon this blog who returned the program they would be brushed aside as “not having given the program a chance to work”. That being the case then the 30 day money back guarantee obviously isn’t enough time to evaluate the program properly. Maybe the guarantee should be 6 months, or a certain number of closed transactions resulting directly from the implementation of the program over say the first year? When you sell thousands of a marketing program, I think it is normal to get a certain number of users who will have success, and many of those would have had success even without it.
To hand pick from those to blog really doesn’t give an unbiased account of whether or not this system works for the vast majority in various markets and conditions. To have people continue to berate those who didn’t find the system effective by using such phrases as ” god forbid you try”, or ” if you’re smart enough and not lazy” is not fair at all.
March 28th, 2007 at 8:03 amJoshua,
You are making far too many assumptions.
I stated that the most important question I had was, “what are your expenses.”
My comment was totally about the average production per agent. I don’t consider 23.5 homes a year per agent to be impressive at all. I didn’t say his income didn’t increase. (although, it’s possible that it didn’t) Again, what are his expenses?
Your comment: “Conversly [sic], even if he is very nice with his other agents by taking 25% on each deal”
Unlike you, I didn’t make assumptions based on hypothetical numbers.
March 28th, 2007 at 8:11 amJim,
My comments were directed at your belittling comment of, “Not really all that impressive is it?”
This little blog post has managed to turn into a ******* contest of who can post helpful counterpoints to the nonsense.
—–
I’m in total agreement that there may be someone from CP coming on here to pump the numbers, but it isn’t me. I have been using his system very recently with some success. I’m by no means a mega agent like you guys and would have been delighted to share my findings except for the harshness of the rhetoric from the likes a Jim. If I were to post saying I used CPs classified to generate a total of 10 leads that ended up in 2 closings (a far better number than most of the internet leads I get) I would hate to be chided.
My whole beef is not exactly what is being said but how you guys are saying. IF you think CP is a SCAM you should just say so and move on. Posting childish sarcasm without real information does nothing.
Incidentally, I find it ironic that the title of the post is CP lied to me. It’s so inflammatory it actually goes in line with what he teaches you, which is basic marketing.
————
Assumptions: We all know the saying. I’m not immume to being on the wrong end of them. It would be quite easy to point out others here who’ve done the same.
1st - Please read the post - I didn’t say his agents were getting 25% I was suggesting they were getting 75% which would indicate a deal much better than the norm.
2nd - I never said he was a broker. I’m not sure who you guys are affiliated with but within our brokerages we have several teams. We can dictate what splits our team members are on, if any.
The ASSumptions were made under a poor scenario to totally counter Jim’s comments. I’d say a 30% increase in income while doing fewer transactions would be an accomplishment. The beauty of the assumptions is no matter how you slice the numbers he did post (except for massive expenses) he always comes out doing better than what I posted.
————–
Finally, if you bothered to listen to more than one of his LIVE and FREE calls you’d find that although there is a great deal of scripting he DOES IN FACT cover the bullet points. Often times, albeit, in not great detail. He has a Q and A session at the end of each call.
JIM & KEN, I challenge you to call and listen in to the calls, record them, and put them here for the masses to listen to your questions and the answers Craig gives you.
A week or so ago someone like Ken said, “I’ve had the QL system for 90 days and it’s not working.” After the obligatory sales pitch to the conference he drilled down to find out that he needs to test different publications and different ads to find out what works. I don’t see how that’s any different than figuring out what key words work.
Nothing is free, so I expect the salespitch. As long as I know it’s coming, I’m fine with it.
This is true of most “FREE” things in R.E. Todd Bates, By Referral Only (now there’s a system full of irony), Buffini and others all have similiar tactics.
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Final shot. “I don’t consider 23.5 homes a year per agent to be impressive at all.”
The number one agent in our office only closed 26 homes last year. With a GCI of 1.8 Million.
If this were Walt’s number who’d be making the ASSumptions then…. =)
You shouldn’t dog someone for posting their success. If Walt turns out to be a paid CP employee to post, then we can all take turns calling him names.
March 28th, 2007 at 5:25 pmKen,
The guarantee is 90 days. Sorry for the long rants.
March 28th, 2007 at 5:26 pmKen,
Missed most of your post in response to Jim’s.
I don’t see an edit function for post either.
Great post. I totally agree. I think the comments about you being lazy, were the fact that you didn’t have clear examples about what didn’t work. I can tell you right now, the CP website is crap unless you drive specific traffic to the landing pages. Furthermore, the best way to do this is through paid for ads.
In fact, his whole system works like that. The ads in the paper aren’t as effective if you don’t use the other tools (again, you don’t have to purchase them through him). I’m having good success with some vendors that are not connected to CP AND I can use them for other stuff, without having to buy extra sites and other services. The core ideas and concepts are worth a look though.
Likewise, berating other posters for having phenomonal success with the system is also wrong. I don’t think they should have to post their numbers. One’s persons success is another man’s failure of a year. Most of us didn’t start out closing 50 homes a year. Those that did, should consider themselves blessed.
My main purpose in posting was to help ad proper weight to a discussion which was clearly so biased.
It would seem to me that the comments written on the website were mean to bash what someone felt was an obvious competitor. I personally think CP has missed the boat by not adding a SEO company to his list of vendors but hey you can’t have it all.
March 28th, 2007 at 5:37 pm“I personally think CP has missed the boat by not adding a SEO company to his list of vendors but hey you can’t have it all.”
You can’t SEO those sites.
March 28th, 2007 at 10:16 pmIf you’re familiar with the CP stuff, then you know I mean AN ADDITIONAL site (with a different “template”). =) He packages stuff in relatively inexpensive items that add up to a huge monthly payment at the end.
I like the guys ideas but I don’t have to use his services if I can do it on my own. It’s convenient for him and a select few who don’t have time to set it up though.
March 29th, 2007 at 2:23 amOK have to say it…Just get a FamousAgent site. They are very SEO friendly and would complement any online presence.
BTW, I am not part of FA and get nothing by saying this.
March 29th, 2007 at 8:15 amJust to throw my two cents in… I am not an agent, but I deal with agents nationally. Hands down, the people that have gone through Craigs programs are the players in their respective markets. I own a different type of lead gen service than most are used to, and we actually SCREEN agents before bringing them on… except Proctor people. I wish I had Proctor people in every market I had, it would make my life, and the lives of my sellers a lot easier.
March 29th, 2007 at 9:40 amI know an agent who started his career using CP’s selling system. He has done very well with it. He is one of the most disciplined business people I know, with a rich business background owning previously successful companies. He took that same mindset to real estate, plugged in the selling system and sold a ton of homes.
March 29th, 2007 at 10:48 amHey all,
Bob, “Welcome to the jungle” !
I’ve asked this at least once before, but since you’re new maybe you could ask you friend to comment on what about the $800 system is generating his business? I think even the people that have had success with the system have pretty much stated the website isn’t that great, as many have gone other ways. I haven’t heard anyone state what in particular about this system has caused them to do so well? I basically focused on the Ads and the 800 lines when I did it, and didn’t get much. Aside from that and the website what else was there that can be attributed to his success? Maybe these ads work better in some areas than others? I don’t know. Josh, thanks for clarifying the 90 day guarantee. That may be enough time to get a pretty good idea if it will work for you or not if you hop right on it. Again, my beef wasn’t with the length of the guarantee, mine was with Craig attempting to stop me from selling my copy when it didn’t work for me. My “plan” was to hang onto it and maybe give it another shot down the road, but when I realized I really wasn’t ever going to do that I decided to sell it, or I would have just sent it back. It wound up costing me $550 by not sending it back, but that’s my fault. However by them pulling my listing on Ebay when they did I did “lose” about $250, as I was the only game in town when I had it for sale at that time. Plus the aggravation of not really having anyone over there to even discuss the situation with me. They broke off all contact with me after just a few e-mails asking why the did what they did, and why they thought they had the right to do it. So I’m still a tad bitter ! ; 0 )
March 29th, 2007 at 11:19 amI find it interesting that this blog post is actually doing a few of the things listed on the 21 items of things to do on a blog. I’m paraphrasing…
1. Outlandish Claims
2. Personal Attacks
3. Salacious Remarks
The value is in creating valuable Unique Selling Propositions and using the correct scripts and wording.
I changed my follow up script when I leave messages on my internet leads. (I get the lead, call it and end up leaving a messsage) I use something that Craig taught me (through his system). I articulate my offer to send listings and now I am getting more call backs.
Before I said, “since you’re not there I’ll send you list… Call me if you have questions or want to update your criteria.”
Now I say, “I want to send you some listings but I need to know your criteria first. The listings will include Distressed Sales and Foreclosures as well as all the homes on the market. I don’t want to overwhelm your e-mail with new listings so please call me back at…. ”
It’s wordy, but it fits my rambling personality.
So far, I’ve picked up a bunch of little things like this.
March 29th, 2007 at 1:43 pmI personally know Walter Gonzalez, He went to the conference in Orlando. www,waltergonzslez.com. He is using the same math as Craig. He lost his entire except his cousin. He only sells 4 - 6 homes per month. The are mostly spanish. He did not close 94 deals. He actually lost his home he was doing a lease to own on. With that being said I have facts, I know what works and what dosent. The sad thing is everyone who has there hand in the jar has great things to say.
Craig is awsome everyone should go. He has taken Jay Abrahm systems and packaged them for agents. The sad thing is if you don’t give him %100 of the credit he will sick part of his staff to blog in his defense. Craig has read these blogs.
Craig if your reading thank you for everything. You helped me out a lot I sold 300 plus deals last year and you help me get the right mind set. With out that I could not of done it. I don’t thing you were next to me pounding the pavement. You did inspire me. You made me see what could be done.
Craig kick out great people. Jeff W Jim S Jeff H Jay K why? Thats what sucks if you don’t drink the water your out. That’s what is sad!
Craig is the man his systems work. I think his business is a lost leader for his production company. All his ads, even his power point is from the 90’s.
Craigs systems work if you do. If you do everything he teaches you will lose money. Thats what his platinum students think. Thats what they talk about in the hot tub, or at lunch between sessions. They think Craigs Real Estate team loses money.
O yea one more thing if you share an idea with him he will take it and call it his own! FYI
March 31st, 2007 at 4:34 pmCraig Proctor Lied to Me. That’s why I wrote this intial post. My intial article was never about his actual system.
He sent a spam email to attend a call and learn some very specific things about working with homebuyers. And I got no specifics.
Ronnie, Mark, and others have apparently experienced the same thing with Craig’s sales calls - all hype and no meat.
Yes, I realize it was a free conference call and not the actual system. But why should that matter? He SOLD me on the free call in order to SELL me on a system. But he let me down at the get-go.
What I discovered was an utter lack of substance and integrity.
Does that sound like the foundation of a great real estate system?
The Craig Proctor “fanboys” on this thread have chosen to post about how great the system has worked for them. Several have posted numbers that others have questioned (with little intelligent response).
So, we offered a “put up or shut up” invitation to shadow a CP agent to verify the numbers. Guess that was enough to shut him up since we haven’t heard a peep from him since.
April 2nd, 2007 at 9:24 pmnew agent says thanks to all comments, even those from the cp’s. i’ve a real problem because i am not a joiner,
April 3rd, 2007 at 5:33 ammingler, networker, or a very good spinner - ie clinton. i guess i could go cut grass. i think there is some heart felt disappointment going on here and there isn’t anything i can do to help - except send you all that majic pill we are all looking for which i haven’t found either.
Liar Liar pants on fire….there are so many of these “sales pinocchio’s” its sooo easy to spot them- just hang around long enough- you will see.
April 3rd, 2007 at 8:26 amO.k., here’s the test, and I’ve asked anyone to post on behalf of the C.P. system, so far no one has stepped up. The BIG QUESTION: What, in the $800 program, works so well that it is worth $800. We’re talking about something in the “system” that doesn’t require spending more money then already spent on system itself ( The $800 ) So far not one response to that question that I’ve asked several times. If there isn’t anything there without laying out thousands of dollars more in 800 numbers, websites, coaching, etc., then just say that. So agents who are struggling and can barely afford the $800 don’t wind up with a bunch of “bloggers” calling them lazy and losers because they didn’t “want to invest in their business and work hard at it.” I’ve heard over and over that $800 isn’t a lot of money, it is if you aren’t getting the turn-key program you thought you were getting. If you spent $800 on a stereo system, then got it home and found out you have to buy a c.d player, tuner, and sign up for lessons to learn how to use it, I think you’d be dissapointed. It wouldn’t make you cheap or lazy, it’s not what you thought it was. And God forbid you didn’t hook it up right away and the 90 day return policy expired. What would you do? But the c.d player, tuner and pay for lessons?
April 3rd, 2007 at 8:45 amThe interesting thing about Craig Proctors system is that it has a multiplication effect that starts to grow after a consistent effort. The systems mesh together and generate a data base increase, a lead increase and a market presence increase that start to escalate and create a true leap in your business. It is a FRANCHISE system that workd much like buying a Starbucks franchise or a McDonalds franchise would work. The failure rate in Real Estate is near 80% but if you implement Craigs systems it should drop to a failure rate of approximately 20%.
April 3rd, 2007 at 7:07 pmI am dominating my market place becuase of Craig’s systems…but it didn’t happen over night. It took a solid year of dedicated effort implementing his program!
OH PLEASE BOB, cut us a break now. How do you have any idea what the success rate is for Realtor’s using the Craig Proctor system?!
…Just tell us what about the $800 system is so great that it’s worth $800 already!!!We’ve established it’s not the website, and you can’t do the ads without purchasing the 800 service, so what is working for you Bob? Can you share that with us??? I’m getting bored listening to all these claims of how great this system is and how everyone is the top agent in their area using it, yet no one has mentioned anything specific to this program that is working so well. Now it takes a year of consistant effort to see results. So much for the 90 day evaluation period.
April 4th, 2007 at 6:01 amI thought this discussion might die off after awhile. I posted my first comment in February after reading Ken’s comments about trying to sell the CP system he bought. Since then I’ve been reading the comments and have looked at several other things going on in the great business ocean we call Real Estate.
Craig Proctor developed a way of doing business that is fairly unique using some state-of-the-art tools such as the AMS hotlines, web pages, and ads designed to drive business to you and help you stand out from the crowd (or as they say in the ocean, the other fish) His methods like technology itself change as new things come along. Before the Internet, there were no web pages. Before phones, no 800 numbers, etc. Craig used these things and worked the real estate business hard to become a success in his market. What he then has done is package the things he does into a system you can buy and use as your own. Some have mentioned franchise on these comments. It’s not a franchise, but the idea is similar. You buy the program and you get set up and trained to use it much like a food franchise does when you buy one.
It takes time and money to play. No one will deny that who is using the program. You have to work it, and you must pay for the 800 numbers, the web sites, the classified ads. You must implement the program, and stay on top of it. You have to get away from your old habits and learn some new techniques.
What I found out was that I knew so very little about my own business and industry after spending years in it doing things the way my company did “just because” it was always done this way. Craig has clearly thought ou- of-the-box for some time now and his selling methods are pretty darn good. The system will help organize any agent or company. There are even sections on how to hire and train staff.
As stated earlier, I had to drop coaching and some aspects of the program as they were too expensive and were not working for me. That’s life and not all markets are the same. I paid to attend the seminar and bought the CP program and am using much of it today. You see yourself differently and you gain more confidence when you understand the business better and can handle questions and objections professionally. I think that too much emphasis in these comments is on how this program falls short and not enough is spent on where it excels.
Take any form of education and you see very quickly that good, valuable learning costs a great deal and not everyone will take the time and spend the dollars to be the best they can be. Learning is an investment. And if our business wasn’t constantly changing, we might all be able to take some time off and just do what we do, but the business, the market, simply will not let us do that. Our clients are expecting more and more from us as professionals and unless we deliver, we become dinosaurs very quickly and die off. Craig is making money off his system. No doubt about it. Where’s the crime? We are all looking for ways to do better and we raise our hands and say “Give me some of that”. Are there other systems or gurus who can do a better job? Maybe. But the CP system will make you a better agent and hopefully more productive too. And, you might even find that you can have a life with family, your hobbbies and other interests. It’s not free, but nothing in the world with any worth ever is. You’re buying an education and a marketing system from someone who developed it and uses it himself. Simple as that. If interested, check it out. If not…that’s your choice, and there may be other options just as good. I just have never seen one as complete as this that is transferrable anywhere. And this is coming from someone who has not had 100% success using the system.
April 4th, 2007 at 12:46 pmHURRAY FOR TOM BROWNE!!! The FIRST person to answer my question! The first person in my opinion who answered on behalf of the Craig Proctor system and wasn’t a jerk about it !!! I can’t dissagree with Tom’s arguement, even though the system still isn’t something I would ever go back to. It takes an intelligent person to put this arguement together which doesn’t make him sound like he works for the company, and thus might actually persuade the other side rather than just tick them off. I hope Tom isn’t actually Craig and his whole staff is laughing at this right now ! ; 0 )
But anyway, well done.
April 4th, 2007 at 1:29 pmwell within the last two weeks I have been busy listing homes. about 1 a day in the last 7 days. I said call me or come by I will show you exactly how I use the system to generate leads and calls from my website and how i was receiveing 150 calls a day. I actually had to get a second cell phone. I am currently out growing my current office space and need to hire another listing agent. As of today no one has contacted me. I will be in dallas for a week at his seminar (I never miss one) and will be more then happy to speak to anyone while I am out there or when I get back.
April 7th, 2007 at 3:02 pmFrank:
April 15th, 2007 at 7:51 pmWhat is your phone number, email address, and web page?
Tom Browne, Thank you for the detailed and honest synopsis of your experience with the CP system.
We always appreciate comments that are professional (and not rude or degrading to others)- regardless of your viewpoint.
April 16th, 2007 at 6:58 pmWell, now that we’ve gotten to this point and aired everything out thoroughly, can anyone tell me about a source for the 800 #’s and websites that can duplicate SuccessWebsites and AMS hotline numbers at a more reasonable cost? I was spending serious cash promoting listings with ads, 800 response numbers and the unbranded websites looking for clients in a slow market. So slow, my marketing costs exceeded my income for awhile. (that’s called the road to bancruptcy). I’m ready now to re-enage but hopefully at a lower cost. Any ideas for me?
April 17th, 2007 at 6:38 amI answered part of my own question. I hit on Andrea’s name and got Famous Agents Websites. They look good! How about 800 numbers? Anyone using anything like the AMS lines? They work well, but at $300 a month they ought to work well.
April 17th, 2007 at 6:42 amHi Tom,
Have you looked into Proquest Technologies? (I have not used their services)
April 17th, 2007 at 7:18 amGreetings everyone-
I attended the CP Superconference in Dallas and appreciate the comments, both positive and negative, on this thread. He is, as are all of his testimonial agents, phenomenal sales people.
I am in a very affluent market where the average purchase price is 1 million plus. Anyone out there been in a similar market and had success with this system? My clientele is sophisticated and usually successful in their respective businesses.
I have been in the business for a few years and last year sold about $8 million. I am consistent and can make a good living doing what I have been doing (traditional lead generation ie open houses, door knocking, etc) but would like to pop my business up to another level. I can definetely sell and can definetely close.
Anyone in a similar marketplace that can comment on the value of this system?
April 19th, 2007 at 12:26 pmComments anyone?
In a market like that you need more of a high touch approach. Look into referral based marketing systems like Brian Buffini. This works very well if you follow the system, heck even if you only sort of follow the system you will make money with it. The more sophisticated the client the more high touch you need to be.
April 19th, 2007 at 7:29 pmDirect cell phone 818-903-5202
email frank@frankbernardo.com
http://www.frankbernardo.com
call or email anytime
DALLAS WAS AWESOME!!!!!
April 20th, 2007 at 9:37 amHis system works awesome in higher end markets. such as the guaranteed sale program. or his buyer programs. If you were in Dallas do you remember Rick Brash and his buyer satisfaction guarantee that one is a big attractor. this system has more tools then any other system especially for higher end homes. I am planning on moving up to our higher end communities such as 2 million + in my area.
April 20th, 2007 at 9:47 amHello All,
I’m a new agent - really new, less than a year. I’ve been working RE part-time and considering going full-time because I really do love this business and would like more freedom and time with my son. I’ve read through the entire thread and I am still considering buying the CP system believe it or not. I bought talking house to help differentiate myself in a tough tough market. I’ve gotten a couple of listings so far but I’ve spent TOO MUCH money on ads that get few or no leads. I’m so tired of checking my voicemail and hearing “You have zero messages” that I could scream! I have a good website (which I update regularly) with IDX and a drip email marketing campaign, and I use the pay-per-click through google adwords and I get lots of traffic to my site but haven’t been able to convert those to good leads because as always, people tend to think you will hound them and don’t want to leave contact information. I bought the Rainmaker brochures to help generate leads — nada. I know these tools are probably working for someone, but unfortunately I’m not one of them. I’d like to get ideas as to how I can make my marketing more effective. Right now I feel like I’m pouring money down an bottomless drain. I’ve been receiving CPs teaser emails and I’ve read all the promo ads but I wanted to get a feel for the value of the system…that’s why I’m here. I thought about using HouseValues but something inside says “uh uhhhh”. I just think that if I’m really trying to build a business and not “do deals” then I better learn how to generate my own leads. I’m a hard worker. Don’t mind putting the hard work in, I probably work more than 70 hours a week in my full time job and trying to build this RE business. I don’t mind investing money but I don’t want to keep working in the red. I just don’t want to keep pouring good money after bad. Will this $800 buck really be worth spending??? I’m leaning toward getting it but I wonder if being successful at this business and getting leads isn’t just going to take time and more hard work. My broker favors cold calling and knocking on doors and building a referral network, but I don’t have the time to do that consistently right now. I do have a partner that I can work with to help field leads so I won’t be alone. Any thoughts?
April 20th, 2007 at 10:05 amI have learned more facts about real real estate selling techniques, coaching, and sales aides in this blog than 40 hours in any seminar.
Thanks to all.
April 20th, 2007 at 2:20 pmTom,
I just jumped on here and have been very interested in the CP program. Like Karla even after reading through everything I still am interested in investing in the program, but tell me and others what are your monthly costs and could you break it down between Web page, 800 number, advertising etc.
April 20th, 2007 at 6:20 pmMy e-mail is johnz.realestate@gmail.com if you want to send info directly.
Craig Proctor’s Program is REAL. I went to the Chicago Seminar and sat in the front row. NO ONE has tought me more about creating leads than Craig. I have a degree in Broadcasting and 11 years of sales and marketing experience in radio and that was great, but the info he gives you in the seminar and package was like a 4 year degree in real estate. I put his plan into action and have realized a 75% increase in listing appointments in the last 4 months. The hotlines work, the websites work, the billboards I am running work and the newspaper ads work. He takes simple stuff and turns it into reality. I am 100 percent convinced that if you are looking to fill in the blanks of your “sphere calls” and referrals, then you need the phone to ring with new leads. HE DOES THAT. When you get in the door, it’s your job to decide if you want the buyer or the seller to work with. If you are a part time REALTOR or someone who is dabbling, then DO NOT do this program. It is for serious NEW AGENTS or EXPERIENCE agents looking to take there career to the next level. I couldn’t wait to buy the coaching, the websites and everything the vendors pitched us…you know why? Because I am not going to re-invent what this man already has proven to be successful! Trust me, it’s worth 3 times the amount he charges.
April 22nd, 2007 at 11:41 pmShawn,
Thanks for your input. Is there a way that I can get started prior to the conference in Denver. I understand there is a 60 trial and while I’m waiting for the conference I’d like to get my feet wet.
Thanks,
John
PS. Not sure who it was, but I know someone was trying to sell CP software on E-Bay. Did he attend the conference? If so did he get his money back? According to CP you follow the system and if it doesn’t work you get your $ back. Did he?
April 23rd, 2007 at 9:42 amShawn an increase in appointments of 75% means what? How many new leads and at what cost.
Next are the leads closing at the same rate as your previous leads? I know from talking to many Proctor system users that the closing percentage goes down due to the misleading advertising that is done.
Next after spending the thousands of dollars what has been your ROI? This really is the ONLY thing that matters.
April 23rd, 2007 at 10:17 amJohn,
I was the one selling it on E-bay, I found this site because I was searching to see if anyone else had Craig Proctor remove their listing from E-bay. No, I didn’t get my money back, but I didn’t ask for it back. ( not during the 60 or 90 day review period. I actually did much later after they contacted Ebay and told them that I purchased a liscense to use this product only and thus couldn’t sell it. ) I asked them to reimburse me $400 ( 1/2 the amount I paid ) since it didn’t work for me and they were now blocking my ability to sell it. They didn’t respond at all. The deciding factor of me giving it a shot was that I knew from seeing them for sale on Ebay that if it didn’t work for me I could always get 1/2 my money back by putting it up on Ebay. I didn’t find it to be worth the money at all. I didn’t get any response from the ads, and if I had I wonder what the reaction was going to be from the “client” when I called them “out of the blue” when they didn’t leave a number or request a call from me. ( the 800 service captures the callers info. ) I also wonder if there is any conflict with the Do Not Call List program. I would ask that specifically when you order it, and also ask for something stating it is o.k. to call in writing in case you ever get someone who complains . Also remember that Craig Proctor is in Canada, I don’t know if the rules are the same there. Again I don’t know if it’s o.k. to solicit business because they requested a free brochure on how to sell you home etc., but it was a concern. However since I didn’t have anyone call the hotline I didn’t have to worry about it !
April 23rd, 2007 at 10:53 amIf you think you are going to get on a free call with Craig and he’s going to reveal his secrets to make you a squillionaire then you are crazy!
Of course you are going to have to pay for it. Real estate is a business, not a job. Change your mindset and invest in yourself.
Craig is a multi-million dollar performer. Good on him! Boo hoo to the naysers!
April 24th, 2007 at 12:05 amGreg Reed,
Your comment is moronic. No one expects to “learn all of his secrets for free”. Everyone is entitled to receive what they are promised in a sales piece. The issue here is Craig’s misleading advertising (more appropriately called spam). Re-read the original article.
In regards to the constant nauseating statements such as, “He’s a multi-million dollar producer, blah, blah, blah.” We all know that Craig loves to bloviate about his gross commissions. Here is one example from his website, “…earned Proctor over $3.5 million in commissions in 2005 selling over 500 homes.” Forget gross! How much did you NET? He has never once bragged about his net income… I wonder why???
Here is one more example of some questionable Craigvertising from successwebsites.com: “How to Become the Dominant Internet Agent in Your Marketplace Overnight… Without Spending a Fortune, Wasting Your Time, or Even Caring How It Works!”
Overnight huh…How’s that for ethics?
Folks, the original article was about his promise to deliver a specific curriculum for free. He didn’t do that. What do you call it when someone makes you a promise and then does not keep it?
I encourage everyone to print the copy of the next email spam they receive from Craig and then listen to the call and see if he delivers on all points. Did he tell the truth?
I don’t expect any honest answers from the Craigboy fan club.
April 24th, 2007 at 7:26 amFor those of you who are new to the business I strongly suggest you stay clear of these type of “systems”. Unless you have unlimited funds to begin with, you will go broke!
Stick to the basics. There are a dozen or so coaching programs out there that will teach you the basics and won’t put you in the poor house.
We have not had a chance to review them all, but here are a few recommendations:
Mike Ferry, Howard Brinton, Todd Bates, or Tom Ferry.
You should also read a couple of goods books on the subject such as, “Millionaire Real Estate Agent” by Gary Keller and/or “List More, Sell More” by Jerry Bresser.
April 24th, 2007 at 7:49 amBy the way, If anyone has a particular real estate trainer/system that they would like us to review, send a message to us through our contact form.
April 24th, 2007 at 7:51 amJim Messenger
Tut tut tut Jim. Calling people moronic is not very nice; especially since we have never met.
Forums are interesting places…they are are magnets for for negative people to vent..
I am by no way a 100% Craig Proctor advocate but I do respect people who are million dollar income earners. Why? because I’m not a million dollar income earner.
Are you Jim?
April 24th, 2007 at 4:08 pmHi all-
I will be signing up for the coaching - I have not used the program but did attend the super conference in Dallas. I have bought the website and when it is up will start the enrollment in the program. I do have the money to invest in this system and am willing to give it a shot. The CP system does have a money back guarantee which I will be using if it does not generate solid leads.
Real estate is a tough, tough business and i feel so badly for the new agents i see coming through the door- particularly ones that do not have a super strong manager or brokerage to give them the training they need.
I will say this- I work for a dominant regional company that has its own training program that is about $5000- and much of it is right out of the CP system.
April 24th, 2007 at 4:22 pmGreg,
If you re-read my earlier comment you will notice that I said that your comment was moronic. If I had meant it to refer to you personally, I would have structured the sentence differently.
So tell me Greg, you consider us to be negative people because we brought attention to Craig’s deceptive spamvertising? (now termed Craigvertising)
FYI, it’s a Blog, not a forum. The Forum can be found at
April 24th, 2007 at 4:58 pmhttp://www.FamousAgents.com/forum/
Greg, you missed the point. That is why Jim pointed out your foolish comments.
The article was about Craig’s deceptive advertising. He lied. Who cares if he has gross – not net – commissions over a million dollars? That does NOT give him the right to spam unsuspecting real estate agents with deceptive messages and empty promises.
We called attention to the fact that he failed to deliver on specific promises. He was unethical to say the least. And, yes, that has certainly swayed our opinion on whether others should invest their money and time with such a person.
Not to mention the fact that there are many other reputable materials available to agents that are proven to work and have a much higher return on investment.
April 24th, 2007 at 6:13 pmErin-
When you say you work for a large company whose materials are right out of the CP system. Are you sure its not the other way around?
There are some basic principles of sales and marketing (with the real estate spin) that have been around for alot longer than he has been alive!
April 24th, 2007 at 6:16 pmAttention all: Get in your last minute posts now because we are officially closing this page for commenting tonight at 9pm MST.
We have allowed just about every point of view to post here - and the direction of the posts have become too off track from the original topic. Thank you for everyone’s participation.
I encourage everyone to read the article that started this thread: Craig Proctor Lied to Me
April 24th, 2007 at 6:27 pmAndrea,
Are you serious? You are closing this blog, or forum, or whatever it is because it’s strayed from the topic?
This has branched off into a very informative discussion between people who feel they were ripped off, and those that were asked to blog on behalf of the company who the others feel ripped them off. I would like to know Andrea, before you pull the plug, what is the real reason for doing so? Is there a cost to running this blog? I’m being honest, not sarcastic. I really don’t understand why you don’t just “let it go”. Had I read something like this before I purchased the Craig Proctor miracle real estate system in a box I wouldn’t have wasted $800 on the system itself, wouldn’t have thrown away hundreds of advertising dollars placing stealth ads, and would have closed at least 2 or 3 sales directly from the farming I would have done had I not spent the money on this. Looking back it reminds me of the cartoon ad for the X-Ray glasses they used to run when I was a kid,you know, the one with the kid looking through his hand ?…..Had I read a blog with people writing in who actually bought the glasses they could tell me it was just a feather in the lense and you really couldn’t see thru anything, I would have saved my 2 bucks. KEEP ONE THING IN MIND PEOPLE…..the ONLY WAY that these folks who are writing with these glowing results about Craig Proctor’s system could find this blog, was if someone told them about it and asked them to comment. People who are “graduates”, and taking coaching with Craig etc., would have no reason to be searching the web for Craig Proctor!, and thus would never find it. They are shills, who were hand picked to write here on behalf of this program. I have no idea why it is being shut down.
April 24th, 2007 at 8:23 pmKen,
Don’t you think there have been plenty of comments on this post? I think that a post approaching 200 comments is far too long for anyone to read. Very few people, if any, will scroll for that long. We have to define an end to the page at some point. How many feet, yards, miles would you say is an acceptable page scroll?
You asked if we have any other motivation for shutting it down. Like what?
The post will still be here. All of the comments will still be here. We just won’t allow any new comments. What’s the problem?
Also, almost every real estate trainer has a section on our forum. If anyone wants to talk about Craig’s systems they can do so at the Craig Proctor section.
As Andrea said above, any possible view point related to the Craig Proctor System has been discussed ad nauseum.
April 24th, 2007 at 8:47 pmAlthough Jim, out of all the comments besides ours, only 2 or 3 actually discussed the point of the original article.
Case in point for ending the comment trail.
Folks who wish to continue this discussion or start a new one can visit the forum. Most of the Real Estate Trainers are discussed there.
April 24th, 2007 at 8:59 pm